Return to the thumbnail page Display/hide file information See previous file See next file

Sylvania/GTE "SUN STICK"

Sylvania/GTE "SUN STICK"

Click to view full size image

Got this little light at the recycle center today when I went to take back the four non working lamps from yesterday. Interestingly, it says "Disposable Fluorescent Fixture", yet the thing still lights up and works perfectly! Lamp is between the length of a F15 and a F20 and is about 3500K. Neon glowbottle is in one end and choke ballast is in the other. Switch is in the cord. Very cheesie but I could not let it get trashed.

2010-12-30_19-01-39_502.jpg 2010-11-17_17-53-08_325.jpg 2010-11-17_17-53-43_244.jpg 2010-11-15_19-55-35_562.jpg

File information

File information

Download: Download this File
Filename:2010-11-17_17-53-43_244.jpg
Album name:DieselNut / Preheat Fluorescents
Keywords:Lanterns
File Size:44 KB
Date added:Nov 17, 2010
Dimensions:1024 x 575 pixels
Displayed:276 times
URL:http://www.lighting-gallery.net/gallery/displayimage.php?pos=-49740
Favorites:Add to Favorites
Comments
icefoglights
Sr. Member
****
Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 391


ITT Low Pressure Sodium NEMA


View Profile Personal Message (Offline)
Nov 17, 2010 at 09:20 PM Author: icefoglights
Wow cool! Looks similar to the GE "BrightStick." An F20T12 3500 K lamp with a glowbottle starter and resistive ballast, all glued together. The mounting slot looks exactly like the one on the BrightStick.
DieselNut
Hero Member
*****
Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 621


John


View Profile Personal Message (Offline)
Nov 17, 2010 at 09:38 PM Author: DieselNut
Funny thing is, the lamp is about 20 inches long...halfway between a F15 and F20. I thought about cutting it down to run a F15 lamp...or just keeping it in the"archive" collection! LOL another crazy thing is the wiring inside is General Electric!
icefoglights, did you see the lamps photo I posted?

Preheat Fluorescents forever!
I love diesel engines, rural/farm life and vintage lighting!

Medved
Hero Member
*****
Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 2094


View Profile Personal Message (Offline)
Nov 18, 2010 at 12:02 AM Author: Medved
What is the F17 length?

No more selfballasted c***

icefoglights
Sr. Member
****
Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 391


ITT Low Pressure Sodium NEMA


View Profile Personal Message (Offline)
Nov 18, 2010 at 12:08 AM Author: icefoglights
F17T8? 24 inches. Basically the T8 equivalent to F20T12.
Medved
Hero Member
*****
Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 2094


View Profile Personal Message (Offline)
Nov 18, 2010 at 12:18 AM Author: Medved
Interesting. In Europe the F18T8 is used as an equivalent to F20T12, so i thought the F17T8 is shorter... It is strange, how lamps intended to replace most popular F40T12 and F20T12 start to differ between Europe and America...

No more selfballasted c***

icefoglights
Sr. Member
****
Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 391


ITT Low Pressure Sodium NEMA


View Profile Personal Message (Offline)
Nov 18, 2010 at 12:23 AM Author: icefoglights
I think F18T8 runs at the same current and on the same ballasts as F20T12. F17T8 runs at the same current as F32T8, just at a lower voltage, allowing them to be run on the same ballasts.
Kev
Jr. Member
**
Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 66



View Profile Personal Message (Offline)
Nov 18, 2010 at 12:53 AM Author: Kev
So the lamp in this is moulded in place then?? Remember those classroos i re-fitted? They were all 24" 18W T8 lamps.

Electrical and Lighting Maintenance engineer dealing with lighting repairs and faults on a daily basis!
Fighting the corner for switch start and SON

DieselNut
Hero Member
*****
Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 621


John


View Profile Personal Message (Offline)
Nov 18, 2010 at 06:23 AM Author: DieselNut
@kevxsi16v, the lamp is a regular, but odd length, T12 lamp, but it has (had!) silicone adhesive on the endcaps and the backside, against the fixture. It has regular medium bipins, but they are connected with push on terminals. It is intended to be thrown away when the lamp dies. It still works well, but it looks like it could be easily hacked down and a regular F15T12 lamp used.
Current lamp has no etch or markings.

Preheat Fluorescents forever!
I love diesel engines, rural/farm life and vintage lighting!

kai
Newbie
*
Offline

Posts: 32


View Profile Personal Message (Offline)
Nov 18, 2010 at 08:59 AM Author: kai
@icefoglights: Indeed, for 220 volts F18T8 is compatible with F20T12, likewise are F36T8 with F40T12 and F58T8 with F65T12. Thus T12 lamps are almost extinct here in Central Europe already for quite some time. They are still needed only for applications where the tube diameter is critical, otherwise T8 tubes can simply be thrown into any existing installation.

In fact I only learned from this website that on 110 volts T8 can not be used in place of T12.
DieselNut
Hero Member
*****
Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 621


John


View Profile Personal Message (Offline)
Nov 18, 2010 at 09:20 AM Author: DieselNut
I have built up quite a nice collection of T12 lamps, thanks to my lifetime of packratting, jobs I have done, rural/urban exploration and now the recycle center. If they do become totally banned in USA, I will have plenty to use for the rest of my life and to pass on to whoever inherits my collection of lights. I am not slowing down on collecting as many T12s as I can and giving away all the acquired T8s and "energy saver" T12s I come across. I hate to see good things thrown away...hence I am a packrat! LOL

Preheat Fluorescents forever!
I love diesel engines, rural/farm life and vintage lighting!

Kev
Jr. Member
**
Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 66



View Profile Personal Message (Offline)
Nov 18, 2010 at 12:48 PM Author: Kev
@Kai on some of the quick start fittings and SRS they will not take T8 here.

Electrical and Lighting Maintenance engineer dealing with lighting repairs and faults on a daily basis!
Fighting the corner for switch start and SON

icefoglights
Sr. Member
****
Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 391


ITT Low Pressure Sodium NEMA


View Profile Personal Message (Offline)
Nov 18, 2010 at 12:54 PM Author: icefoglights
In North America, T8 lamps require all new ballasts and can't run on the ballasts that ran T12 lamps. That's partly responsable for T12 lamps still being in common use here. However, 2 foot, 3 foot and 4 foot T8 lamps can usually all be run off the same ballast.
Medved
Hero Member
*****
Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 2094


View Profile Personal Message (Offline)
Nov 18, 2010 at 02:27 PM Author: Medved
he T12 are nearly extinct specie in the Europe, as the vast majority of ballasts are preheat, what in fact separate electrode heating and ignition attempts in time, so work well with both argon T12 as well as krypton T8.

However in America RS ballasts are common and these have to be quite precisely tuned for the starting characteristic and it mean, then T12 ballast would not ignite the T8 lamp (so not working combination) and the T8 ballast would cold-start the T12 (ignite the discharge before electrodes heat up - so reduce lamp cycle life)
And the same apply of course for European "SRS" or "quckstart" ballasts, as these are in fact forms of a Rapid Start concept - using OCV not enough to ignite lamp with cold electrodes, but enough when they reach emission temperature and at the same time provide electrode heating. So lamp always start with hot electrodes (so long cycle life) and just as these reach the required temperature (so short starting time - ~1second or less)

No more selfballasted c***

DieselNut
Hero Member
*****
Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 621


John


View Profile Personal Message (Offline)
Nov 18, 2010 at 03:02 PM Author: DieselNut
I wonder why we don't have the 36 watt 4 foot T8 lamps available here? I would imagine they would work well with our preheat (switchstart) ballasts.

Preheat Fluorescents forever!
I love diesel engines, rural/farm life and vintage lighting!

Medved
Hero Member
*****
Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 2094


View Profile Personal Message (Offline)
Nov 18, 2010 at 03:59 PM Author: Medved
My guess would be, then they wouldn't work on existing RS ballast and with the assumption, then the preheat blinking would be assumed as unacceptable step back in the lighting technology. So lamp makers went with other approach: Create a more efficient lamp with the same lumen output and size and viola, we have F32T8. It benefit from higher voltage and lower current (so lower electrode losses), but as the compatibility requirement was dropped (as anyhow not feasible to maintain with RS), who care.

In Europe the compatibility requirement was kept - as it was of no problem with preheat, so the strategy went into offering more lumens for only slightly lower wattage, but compatible with (vast majority of) existing fixtures.

No more selfballasted c***

Kev
Jr. Member
**
Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 66



View Profile Personal Message (Offline)
Nov 18, 2010 at 04:30 PM Author: Kev
I still use the 40W T12 Lamps where the old fittings are designed to take them. I will send you a couple 36W T8 lamps if you want dieselnut?

Electrical and Lighting Maintenance engineer dealing with lighting repairs and faults on a daily basis!
Fighting the corner for switch start and SON

DieselNut
Hero Member
*****
Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 621


John


View Profile Personal Message (Offline)
Nov 18, 2010 at 04:49 PM Author: DieselNut
@Kevxsi16v, yes, throw em in the collection. I will throw in a few of our F32T8s in the box I send you.

Preheat Fluorescents forever!
I love diesel engines, rural/farm life and vintage lighting!

kai
Newbie
*
Offline

Posts: 32


View Profile Personal Message (Offline)
Nov 18, 2010 at 06:02 PM Author: kai
You prompted me to look up the T8 matter...

The lamp voltage for F36T8 is quoted as 103 volts at a current of 0.44 amperes. These parameters arise with a series choke ballast for running F40T12 lamps on a 220/240 volts supply. But the ballasts for 120 volts supply are apparently not able to ensure these 103 volts, thus are not compatible with these lamps.

Aren't F20T12 lamps run with a simple series choke also on 120 volts? In this case a European F18T8 lamp could work as well, but I suspect that already the different frequency makes the ballasts incompatible.
icefoglights
Sr. Member
****
Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 391


ITT Low Pressure Sodium NEMA


View Profile Personal Message (Offline)
Nov 18, 2010 at 06:35 PM Author: icefoglights
Reactor (choke) ballasts can be used when the supply voltage is at least roughly double the lamp's operating voltage. F20T12s do run off a simple choke ballast on 120v, and although F18T8s are somewhat rare here, they will run on the same ballasts. Since F40T12s run on a voltage much closer to supply (around 101v) they require an autotransformer ballast to run on 120v.

I currently have 4 fixtures in my house that use F20T12s. All use a simple choke ballast with preheat/switch-start.
Medved
Hero Member
*****
Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 2094


View Profile Personal Message (Offline)
Nov 19, 2010 at 03:05 PM Author: Medved
As the T12 are the same over the globe (F65T12 supplied by 0.65A, arc voltage a bit above 100V, F40T12 0.43A, again a bit above 100V and F20T12 0.37A, about 60V) and European T8 (F58T8, F36T8 and F18T8) are designed to be compatible on preheat ballast, this compatibility would be valid worldwide (but limited only for preheat ballasts, RS won't work). So if you have preheat ballast for F40T12, the F36T8 would work there well and so on...

No more selfballasted c***

DieselNut
Hero Member
*****
Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 621


John


View Profile Personal Message (Offline)
Nov 19, 2010 at 04:18 PM Author: DieselNut
I don't see why a USA F40 preheat ballast wouldn't light a 36 watt European replacement lamp. I wanna try it when kevxsi16v and I make our trade.

Preheat Fluorescents forever!
I love diesel engines, rural/farm life and vintage lighting!

Kev
Jr. Member
**
Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 66



View Profile Personal Message (Offline)
Nov 19, 2010 at 05:02 PM Author: Kev
I think they will work to be honest! I have plently of 36W T8 lamps kicking around! Will dig some out i gotta get some stuff together now, Will try and do it over the weekend!

Electrical and Lighting Maintenance engineer dealing with lighting repairs and faults on a daily basis!
Fighting the corner for switch start and SON

DieselNut
Hero Member
*****
Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 621


John


View Profile Personal Message (Offline)
Nov 19, 2010 at 06:17 PM Author: DieselNut
Cool! Me too!!

Preheat Fluorescents forever!
I love diesel engines, rural/farm life and vintage lighting!

Powell
Hero Member
*****
Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 539


View Profile Personal Message (Offline)
Jun 13, 2011 at 09:42 AM Author: Powell
I have no trouble getting a F17 T8 to work on preheat. There's a T8 made for solid state ballasts that the F17 and so on run on, mine have faded off writing...but they work fine in my desk lamp. They are 6500K and brighter than the regular preheat ones. They have seemed to age correctly....


Powell

NNNN!

© 2005-2014 Lighting-Gallery.net | Powered by: Coppermine Photo Gallery