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What happened!

What happened!

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These were working but I did have to twist the bulbs originally when I first installed them. But when I came back a few hours later this happened this is from the F48 HO haul. It's the two GeS and one universal. I think the Ges are origanl from the late 50s universal is from 1966

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Filename:20180111_212216.jpg
Album name:veryhighonoutput / HO!
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Date added:Jan 11, 2018
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paintballer22
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120V/240V 60hz


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Jan 11, 2018 at 09:41 PM Author: paintballer22
Where they lit or did you just turned them on?
veryhighonoutput
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Jan 11, 2018 at 10:06 PM Author: veryhighonoutput
They were lit for 3 hours strait then i turned them off for 2 hours but when I came back to check on them this happened.

T12/ t17 there's a reason they made heavy magnetic ballasts

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SodiumVapor 105843202020668111118 UCpGClK_9OH8N4QkD1fp-jNw majorpayne1226
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Jan 11, 2018 at 10:36 PM Author: HomeBrewLamps
is it really cold there or something?

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120V/240V 60hz


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Jan 11, 2018 at 10:43 PM Author: paintballer22
Bad ground?
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^homebuilt fixture


GoL ATL
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Jan 11, 2018 at 10:58 PM Author: xmaslightguy
Do they fire up if you run your hand along the lamps?
Or flip the switch on/off a few times?

Colored Fluorescent's such as F40T12 Red or  Green or Blue are awesome...

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Jan 11, 2018 at 11:03 PM Author: veryhighonoutput
Yes if you flip a few times or switch the lamps around a bit they come on eventually 45 degrees

T12/ t17 there's a reason they made heavy magnetic ballasts

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Jan 11, 2018 at 11:10 PM Author: dor123
I almost thought this is as a result of a brownout, as it was happened to me with my Radium Relux 9W/840, during a brownout in my hostel last year.

I"m don't speak english well, and rely on online translating to write in this site.
Please forgive me if my choice of my words looks like offensive, while that isn't my intention.

I only working with the European date format (dd.mm.yyyy).

I hope that LED won't replace all forms of other light

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Jan 12, 2018 at 12:10 AM Author: veryhighonoutput
I t hink the caps are fried. I had this happen to a f96t12 advance from 2002. But weird only around 45 degrees out

T12/ t17 there's a reason they made heavy magnetic ballasts

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Jan 12, 2018 at 02:42 AM Author: dor123
When the capacitor of a rapid-start ballast fails, the lamp should flash like this , and not glow at the filaments, like a preheat with a stuck starter.

I"m don't speak english well, and rely on online translating to write in this site.
Please forgive me if my choice of my words looks like offensive, while that isn't my intention.

I only working with the European date format (dd.mm.yyyy).

I hope that LED won't replace all forms of other light

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Jan 12, 2018 at 06:24 AM Author: veryhighonoutput
Well it's probably a deeper issue then. I'll have to test all of them now

T12/ t17 there's a reason they made heavy magnetic ballasts

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T12/T17 Let's keep them while we have them!


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Jan 12, 2018 at 06:30 AM Author: F96T12 DD VHO
I have a 36 watt tube that does that but they move back and forth

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Jan 12, 2018 at 08:16 AM Author: dor123
Not surprising, the 36W T8, have krypton, which have a much higher starting voltage the OCV of an F40T12 rapid-start ballast. 36W T8 can only start reliably on preheat or electronic ballast.

I"m don't speak english well, and rely on online translating to write in this site.
Please forgive me if my choice of my words looks like offensive, while that isn't my intention.

I only working with the European date format (dd.mm.yyyy).

I hope that LED won't replace all forms of other light

F96T12 DD VHO
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T12/T17 Let's keep them while we have them!


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Jan 12, 2018 at 08:39 AM Author: F96T12 DD VHO
Yeah, both ends just glow orange while getting blacker
It's also on a electronic ballast

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Jan 12, 2018 at 09:02 AM Author: veryhighonoutput
Yep again today glowed orange. Won't do nothing until you touch it or disconnect, annoying. I may just make vho but the ceiling is pretty low but just for fun

T12/ t17 there's a reason they made heavy magnetic ballasts

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Jan 12, 2018 at 10:02 AM Author: dor123
Have you a brownout in case?

I"m don't speak english well, and rely on online translating to write in this site.
Please forgive me if my choice of my words looks like offensive, while that isn't my intention.

I only working with the European date format (dd.mm.yyyy).

I hope that LED won't replace all forms of other light

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Jan 12, 2018 at 05:35 PM Author: xmaslightguy
I would check to just to make sure you're actually getting 120v (or 277v, whatever it should be), and a ground.
Did these sit unused for a long time? Maybe the capacitors did infact fail.


@dor123:
Its not uncommon for US rapid-start's to just end-glow when the capacitor fails.

Colored Fluorescent's such as F40T12 Red or  Green or Blue are awesome...

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Jan 12, 2018 at 06:01 PM Author: veryhighonoutput
I got a full 120volts in fact i ran a 20amp dedicated line to these. I just ended up putting vho universals in there place. I'm sure if you attempted to change the caps they would most likely fire I think this is the problem. They run fine when run ing its just the first initial firing.

T12/ t17 there's a reason they made heavy magnetic ballasts

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suzukir123
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Jan 12, 2018 at 06:04 PM Author: suzukir122
Wait I'm confused lol... you left these on, came back and found them like this? Or did this happen
when you turned them back on?
If there are really 3 fixtures doing this all at the same time, something is up... unless these are running with low OCV
HO ballasts. Regardless of whether it's the OCV or the capacitor failing, if it were me I'd probably replace all of those ballasts
with HO ballasts from a different company, with higher OCV, and a different kind of capacitor. Maybe. lol!

This looks like something that would occur during one of my creepy nightmares.

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Jan 12, 2018 at 07:29 PM Author: nicksfans
Sounds like bad caps may have caused a drop in OCV. It happens a lot with 80s Advance ballasts. One of my F48/HO fixtures started doing this today too, but it has a relatively new Power Lighting Products ballast.

I like my lamps thick, my ballasts heavy, and my fixtures tough.

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veryhighonoutput
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Jan 12, 2018 at 07:49 PM Author: veryhighonoutput
This happened when I had them on for a couple hours then turned off , left for 30 minutes came back then turned back on. They are 1 universal, 2 General electric. The date on back of universal is 1/66 I presume that's the date not sure about the ges are but there not spiced in like the universals. My gess they late 50s or 1960?

T12/ t17 there's a reason they made heavy magnetic ballasts

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Jan 12, 2018 at 08:04 PM Author: funkybulb
My old house will glow like this when it very
Cold outside. Also when tubes are near EOL
It would just sit there and glow at both ends
Until u flick switch just enough to break the circuit
To induce inductive kick. But With near EOL tubes it just becomes harder and harder to strike
It ran a Westy F40CW on this ballast for 24 years
Until that one end fail to glow cant even tturn
On with fick of the switch. Id just replace the
Tubes and works normally again.

That video Dor123 is just a EOL tube causing
Those flicker trying to start.

No LED gadgets, spins too slowly.  Gotta  love preheat and MV. let the lights keep my meter spinning.

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Jan 12, 2018 at 08:13 PM Author: funkybulb
VHO i would comform that ballast in a warmer
Place see if fires up. It cause those ballast
Have lower OCV to if cap goes bad
The ocv drops so does lamp current
Measure the lamp current with a amp
Meter if it close to 700-800 mA the
Ballast is ok just low ocv to start in
Cold weather. Now if current way off
And low ocv then it a sure tale take sign
Of a bad cap.

No LED gadgets, spins too slowly.  Gotta  love preheat and MV. let the lights keep my meter spinning.

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Jan 13, 2018 at 07:18 AM Author: veryhighonoutput
But the kicker is its 50 degrees out i think yesterday was close to 60 and this was still happening. I'm thinking to set up one In my basement next its about 65 -68 maybe a few degrees warmer and drier will make a difference

T12/ t17 there's a reason they made heavy magnetic ballasts

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Jan 13, 2018 at 10:06 AM Author: xmaslightguy
Quote
I got a full 120volts in fact i ran a 20amp dedicated line to these. I just ended up putting vho universals in there place.

Nice upgrade on the VHO's


Quote
But the kicker is its 50 degrees out i think yesterday was close to 60 and this was still happening.

Even the original night when it was 45 ... that's not cold (atleast in my book .lol. )
Even if it was teens I would still expect a HO fixture to fire .. now if you start talking below zero, that's the point where its not just 'cold', but 'fu*king cold' I might then I could see just end glow.
Sadly the original ballasts are bad Its too bad US ballasts aren't like the UK ones that have an external capacitor.

Colored Fluorescent's such as F40T12 Red or  Green or Blue are awesome...

veryhighonoutput
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Jan 13, 2018 at 02:36 PM Author: veryhighonoutput
Thx Xmas, I made a good decision on going vho on these except that back one. I put a single advance f48 ballast in there and wired up one bulb. But to my surprise that ballast is doing the same thing! I got 3 of those single HO ballasts( the long ones same length as a vho) I gess I need to test those too uggg

T12/ t17 there's a reason they made heavy magnetic ballasts

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Jan 13, 2018 at 09:29 PM Author: Powergroove
A levis plant I worked at had F96 HO ballast that would fail in this way. When the plant closed the original ballast had ran 33 years 24/7. This factory had over 3500 F96 HO fixtures in it. It was so big that when you walked in the front you couldn't see back of the plant with out walking toward it. The laundry building had another 250 fixtures in it. Some of those were VHO.

Keep government out of the lighting industry.

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Jan 13, 2018 at 09:44 PM Author: veryhighonoutput
Wow that must of been incredible

T12/ t17 there's a reason they made heavy magnetic ballasts

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Jan 13, 2018 at 11:33 PM Author: arcblue
I've had nightmares where this happened. Also in real life, where too much dust gets on a rapid start tube and it can't get a good ground, or if the ballast is failing. Or of course bad starters if it's a preheat fixture.

I'm lampin...

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Jan 14, 2018 at 05:56 AM Author: Ash
I have recently restored a 2x110 HO lantern. The design common here, with 2 identical single lamp RS ballasts, where capacitors are accessible

It had 1 old tube that still worked and 1 tube that glowwed in the ends, dim Orange. Both tubes tested ok in another lantern. Inside it, wiring was all bare (isolation eaten by mice), it was not shorting just because of not touching !!. Capacitors one measured reduced capacity (the one that still worked) and one was dead

Anyway, complete cleanup, rewire, 2 new capacitors and 2 new Alto lamps, and it would not start - both lamps glow in the ends and thats it. I held the plug in the "arcing position" and the lamps started, so i let them burn in. Now they usually start fine, but sometimes one or another or both do not. Then if i leave it powered for an hour and come back, it is working
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Jan 14, 2018 at 06:51 AM Author: veryhighonoutput
Sounds simular to this unfortunately I wasn't going to bother changing the caps I'm currently involved with a ballast now i got on ebay with crapy wires im trying to restore of coarse its sealed kind with loads of tar and it's
Time consuming and pain in the a. But I wish I could so I wouldn't have to recycle. They worked ok when it got to a low temperature for some reason or i jiggled slightly or flicked the switch a few times but in reality I didn't want to deal with this on a daily basis when I needed light. I may just set up one fixture and run thru some tests I'd like to test the other 9 universal ballasts. I started with the oldest most worn looking ones anyways with low expectations.

T12/ t17 there's a reason they made heavy magnetic ballasts

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Jan 14, 2018 at 08:08 AM Author: Ash
Can you dig the tar just enough to reach the inner connection to the capacitor ?
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Jan 14, 2018 at 10:43 AM Author: veryhighonoutput
You can but it's buried in there. I think I should of preheat the whole ballast in a oven its hard and brittle. Might be easier if wires to start are in good shape. The one I'm dealing with all wires are junk

T12/ t17 there's a reason they made heavy magnetic ballasts

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Jan 14, 2018 at 01:38 PM Author: Ash
If you do, what wires is the capacitor connected to on the inside ? (what is the complete schematic of the ballast) ?
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Jan 14, 2018 at 02:52 PM Author: veryhighonoutput
The blue wires and the black are connected to capacitor ill see if I can up with a diagram. I did post a vho ballast opened up in my gear album.

T12/ t17 there's a reason they made heavy magnetic ballasts

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