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Philips CDM halides

Philips CDM halides

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Sadly Philips’s quartz halide lamps are now so poorly built and unreliable, I’m not using them again for maintenance jobs!, the ceramic ones are the way forward. Ordered some of these in for this job

33E514C1-AC7A-4BFA-9419-D2BD57232C01.jpeg 30ADCC60-7F13-4B42-8333-8AC6A377FBB9.jpeg 1E28784A-D15A-482A-B21B-989B22D383BD.jpeg 7E47758D-83DF-4DDD-AA98-9BF6E39EB551.jpeg

Light Information

Light Information

Manufacturer:Philips
Model Reference:CDM-T MW eco
Lamp
Lamp Type:Ceramic halide
Base:E40
Service Life:30,000 hrs to 50% failures
Fixture
Fixture Type:Lowbay
Ballast Type:Wire wound
Electrical
Wattage:230
Voltage:134
Current:2.14
Optical
Lumen Output:21,900
Color Temperature:4200

File information

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Album name:AngryHorse / Metal halide lamps and lighting
Keywords:Lamps
File Size:628 KB
Date added:Jun 09, 2019
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Date Time:2019:06:07 11:08:45
DateTime Original:2019:06:07 11:08:45
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dor123
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Jun 09, 2019 at 02:15 AM Author: dor123
I think the title and description don't match the picture, which is of Philips CDM-T MW Eco 230W/842 E40 CMH lamp.

I"m don't speak English well, and rely on online translating to write in this site.
Please forgive me if my choice of my words looks like offensive, while that isn't my intention.

I only working with the European date format (dd.mm.yyyy).

I lives in Israel, which is a 230-240V, 50hz country.

AngryHorse
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Jun 09, 2019 at 02:38 AM Author: AngryHorse
yeah, corrected now, I accidentally logged off whilst uploading this page!!

Current: UK 230V, 50Hz
Power provider: e.on energy
Street lighting in our town: Philips UniStreet LED

"Beauty fades, dumb is forever".......Judge Judy Cheesy

dor123
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Jun 09, 2019 at 03:50 AM Author: dor123
Is this lamp operates on dedicated electronic ballast similar to the Cosmopolis, or on 250W HPS ballast?

I"m don't speak English well, and rely on online translating to write in this site.
Please forgive me if my choice of my words looks like offensive, while that isn't my intention.

I only working with the European date format (dd.mm.yyyy).

I lives in Israel, which is a 230-240V, 50hz country.

AngryHorse
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Jun 09, 2019 at 05:51 AM Author: AngryHorse
They are like standard halide lamps, designed to run on standard 250 watt mercury gear.

Current: UK 230V, 50Hz
Power provider: e.on energy
Street lighting in our town: Philips UniStreet LED

"Beauty fades, dumb is forever".......Judge Judy Cheesy

Max
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Jun 09, 2019 at 08:33 AM Author: Max
In fact those CDM MW Ecos can run on both HPM and HPS control gears, like HPI Plus lamps. 230 W is the lamp consumption when run on a mercury lamp ballast, this wattage increases to 275 W when a HPS ballast is used (while this raises the lumen efficacy by more than 10 %, the service life to 50 % failure is reduced to ~18 kh).

By the way, how bad have the life and reliability of HPI lamps become? What's your experience which those lamps in the field? I am following an installation of seven PRC-made HPI-T Plus 400W that have been running 3.5 h per night for three and a half years on HPS gears (corresponding to ~4.5 kh, or 56 % of the mean life at 50 % failure at this usage rate), and all of them are still going strong.
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Jun 09, 2019 at 09:15 AM Author: AngryHorse
Afternoon Max, thanks for the info on the gear, as for the life of the quartz ones, a few of our guys in the UK have had problems with the HPIs lately, on one job a warehouse was fitted with the 400 watt ones, (Belgium at that), and within just 8 weeks they started dropping like flies!!
I fitted a full box of 12 to our paint shop, and they have all changed to different colours now, again only a month old, and those were Belgium ones too!
I can understand this in the Chinese ones, but you would expect better from the Turnhout factory??

Current: UK 230V, 50Hz
Power provider: e.on energy
Street lighting in our town: Philips UniStreet LED

"Beauty fades, dumb is forever".......Judge Judy Cheesy

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Jun 09, 2019 at 09:25 AM Author: Max
Good Afternoon AngryHorse - Yes, you would (should) definitely expect anything better from Turnhout... Where they HPI-T Plus lamps made after 2000? The transfer of the HPI assembly line to China occurred around 2013 if I remember correctly, so the problems you are referring to, if they are not related to an improper usage of the lamps, signify that quality began going downhill way earlier than I thought.
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Jun 09, 2019 at 09:39 AM Author: AngryHorse
The 400s that Rich used in the warehouse were date code 2M, and the 250s I put in our paint shop were date code K9.
We have all decided in our little UK group to not use the quartz ones anymore, opting for the far superior ceramic ones for re-lamping jobs now

Current: UK 230V, 50Hz
Power provider: e.on energy
Street lighting in our town: Philips UniStreet LED

"Beauty fades, dumb is forever".......Judge Judy Cheesy

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Jun 09, 2019 at 09:44 AM Author: Max
I suppose that would be December 2012 and October 2009, so these should have been good lamps indeed, what a shame. The decision to switch to ceramic is a good one, but the lamps are significantly more expensive than the quartz ones (it's not a problem considering the improved reliability and longevity though).
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Jun 09, 2019 at 09:57 AM Author: AngryHorse
Now that’s interesting, as I’m not well up on Philips date codes, we thought they could have been a bad batch?, but the three years difference in both boxes suggests otherwise?

Current: UK 230V, 50Hz
Power provider: e.on energy
Street lighting in our town: Philips UniStreet LED

"Beauty fades, dumb is forever".......Judge Judy Cheesy

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Jun 09, 2019 at 10:03 AM Author: Max
A bad batch is a possibility, but the three years difference rules this out indeed... Either quality has really gone down the drain, or those lamps did not run at their correct specs for some reasons.
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Jun 09, 2019 at 10:10 AM Author: AngryHorse
Hmmm, don’t know about Rich’s warehouse, but our paint shop lowbay are Philips, with Philips’s own gear in them, so you’d think they should be a perfect match?

Current: UK 230V, 50Hz
Power provider: e.on energy
Street lighting in our town: Philips UniStreet LED

"Beauty fades, dumb is forever".......Judge Judy Cheesy

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Jun 09, 2019 at 10:18 AM Author: Max
Honestly, I don't know, but by the look of it it seems that quality is definitely an issue. That could well be the result of consistent problems in the production lines that have developed as a result of cost cutting measures that were applied to lower the cost price of lamps. I still have my doubts because what you describe are essentially very early failures (one to two months of usage is less than 500 h), indicative of either some really extremely bad production issues, or problems in the way the lamps are operated. Were all the lamps run on luminaires designed for diffuse elliptical bulbs? The ballasts, were they of the HPS or HPM kind?
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Jun 09, 2019 at 10:29 AM Author: AngryHorse
Ours are mercury ballasts, we have a few workshops with the same Philips lowbays, but our paint shop is the only one I’ve had problems with at the minute?

Current: UK 230V, 50Hz
Power provider: e.on energy
Street lighting in our town: Philips UniStreet LED

"Beauty fades, dumb is forever".......Judge Judy Cheesy

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Jun 09, 2019 at 10:32 AM Author: Max
OK, so the lamps were clearly not overdriven. It could then be related to some lamp quality issues, not the same ones for Rich as for you (i.e. different batch problems, that is...).

Did you use the same batch of philips lamps for your paint shop and for other (less troublesome) shops? Or were different batches used?
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Jun 09, 2019 at 10:41 AM Author: AngryHorse
The ones in the other shops were not fitted by me, so I don’t know what date code they are, but their definitely HPIs.
Do you reckon I could have some bad ballasts?, as two of these in our paint shop are very noisy?, and one of the lamps is practically green, suggesting it’s being under run?

Current: UK 230V, 50Hz
Power provider: e.on energy
Street lighting in our town: Philips UniStreet LED

"Beauty fades, dumb is forever".......Judge Judy Cheesy

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Jun 09, 2019 at 10:43 AM Author: Max
A bad ballast could be a possibility, but several of them... do all 250W low-bay luminaires have the same Philips ballast and are of the same age?
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Jun 09, 2019 at 10:50 AM Author: AngryHorse
Yes their all original to the building, and all have identical gear trays in as these https://www.lighting-gallery.net/gallery/displayimage.php?pos=-122347?

Current: UK 230V, 50Hz
Power provider: e.on energy
Street lighting in our town: Philips UniStreet LED

"Beauty fades, dumb is forever".......Judge Judy Cheesy

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Jun 09, 2019 at 10:53 AM Author: Max
OK, have the paint shop luminaires ever been used with "special" lamps, e.g. Venture leftovers or other lamps that are not supposed to be compatible with the Philips BHL250 ballast? Any possibility that the mains feeding those luminaires is not 230-240 V?
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Jun 09, 2019 at 10:58 AM Author: AngryHorse
Ah now, I did pull about six Ventures out of the 12, with the rest being HPIs, and the power to the building is a generous 200 amp feed, but they could have suffered some sort of power problems in the past? I’m not sure?

Current: UK 230V, 50Hz
Power provider: e.on energy
Street lighting in our town: Philips UniStreet LED

"Beauty fades, dumb is forever".......Judge Judy Cheesy

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Jun 09, 2019 at 10:59 AM Author: Max
Those Venture lamps, were they designed to be run on HPS control gears instead? If so, then their arc voltage was too low (a problem that was exacerbated by the fact that these lamps were also underdriven), which drew too much current from the ballast, and this may have damaged them over the years.
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Jun 09, 2019 at 11:01 AM Author: AngryHorse
That’s starting to make sense yes, would explain why some of them are noisy?

Current: UK 230V, 50Hz
Power provider: e.on energy
Street lighting in our town: Philips UniStreet LED

"Beauty fades, dumb is forever".......Judge Judy Cheesy

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Jun 09, 2019 at 11:05 AM Author: Max
Yes, that would explain why some of them are now noisy (a high current operation for an extended period of time will result in severe overheating of the ballast, whose encapsulating material will degrade, resulting in the core and coil becoming loose). In light of this, I would strongly advise you to check those ballasts, see if they still regulate your lamps properly or if they need to be replaced.
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