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3-phase experimental lamp

3-phase experimental lamp

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Only one piece was made, this light on 1-phase only - left

E_55_Tesla_RVLR_50W.JPG E_56_(2).jpg E_56_(3).JPG J_018_a.jpg

Light Information

Light Information

Manufacturer:TESLA, plant No.1 Holešovice
Lamp
Base:special
Electrical
Wattage:ca 125
Physical/Production
Fabrication Date:unknown, maybe around 1985

File information

File information

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Filename:E_56_(3).JPG
Album name:Trianero2012 / Mercury lamps
Keywords:Lamps
File Size:226 KB
Date added:Sep 21, 2012
Dimensions:1093 x 2050 pixels
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Globe Collector
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Sep 21, 2012 at 08:02 AM Author: Globe Collector
What sort of cap does it have, one like an American "Three-Lite", E40d?

Manufactured articles should be made to be used, not made to be sold!

Fee, Fye, Fow, Fum, A dead man's eye and a parrot's BUM!

rjluna2
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Sep 21, 2012 at 08:54 AM Author: rjluna2
Cool, just like full wave recifier as if it is the Mecury Vapor Rectifier Tube

Probably for the two phase system

Pretty, please no more Chinese failure.

Trianero2012
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Sep 21, 2012 at 08:55 AM Author: Trianero2012
Something similar, one isolated ring more and metalic rod
Ash
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Sep 21, 2012 at 10:03 AM Author: Ash
Rjluna2 - This lamp looks to me as if it would be for real 3 phase. the 3 tubes of the Y are of similar size/length, for the same loading on each phase. I would expect the midpoint part of the tube to be shorter in a 2-phase lamp with midpoint

Now what is its purpose ?

Efficiency - probably not. In 2 phase system you can just as well use plain arc tube with 2 ends between the phases (with a ballast), higher voltage allow you to use longer arc tube etc. No much sense in having midpoint in such lamp as i dont think it'd even add to efficiency (all 3 electrodes need to be kept hot so dissipate energy as heat, but 2 of them make use of it only 1/2 of the time so we kinda waste the extra losses of 1 electrode)

Here is my guess - they tried to make flicker-free (arc moving but not going off) mercury lamp without electronic ballasts in existence, by using a design which has an arc at some moment. With the added benefit that the arc does not need restriking kick after the AC zero crossing. As such, this lamp would not even need "proper" 3 phase supply since all phases for the lamp can be derived from the same phase with capacitors and perhaps another coil or two in the ballast
rjluna2
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Sep 21, 2012 at 10:36 AM Author: rjluna2
@Ash: I am thinking of the 240 Volts/120 Volts split with dual ballast for each circuit. The neutral would be the return circuit. that we have in our supply main that may be used in this case.

If you were talking about the three phase system, it would be a 4 electrode arc with one as common return for the 3 phase Y-system.

Pretty, please no more Chinese failure.

f36t8
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Sep 21, 2012 at 11:20 AM Author: f36t8
@rjluna2: there is no need for the forth electrode in a Y-system if the load is matched between all phases, since there will be no net voltage at the midpoint.
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Sep 21, 2012 at 11:35 AM Author: marcopete87
i need only an DeLorean with mr. fusion, the flux capacitor is there

however, does this needs 3 ballasts?
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Sep 21, 2012 at 12:07 PM Author: Ash
In 2 or 3 phase circuits. the neutral (center point) is required only if you want to get the voltage of 1 phase (so you can connect stuff to 1 phase and neutral). But if you just need the power, you can connect stuff between the phases and dont need the center point, can leave it unconnected

Also for 2 phase (US-like) 2 phase there is no sense to make an arc tube with 3 electrodes (all you get is extra complexity and extra electrode to waste energy on), just connect it to the 2 phases with simple ballast. Thats exactly what is done with ordinary mercs on 240V

It would use 3 chokes for real 3 phase supply, or autotransformer + capacitor + maybe a choke or two as well for fake 3 phases derived from 1 real phase
dor123
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Sep 21, 2012 at 12:11 PM Author: dor123
How a high pressure mercury arctube, can be Y shaped?
Also, operating this arctube like this (Discharge don't passes the right part of the arctube), results in the mercury being condense in the unionised part of the arctube, resulting in a poor performance.

I"m don't speak English well, and rely on online translating to write in this site.
Please forgive me if my choice of my words looks like offensive, while that isn't my intention.

I only working with the European date format (dd.mm.yyyy).

I lives in Israel, which is a 230-240V, 50hz country.

Ash
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Sep 21, 2012 at 01:01 PM Author: Ash
It is specially formed arc tube

It is by far not the most complex way to shape glass parts of lamps. I think it would be better if all 3 parts of the Y would be straight (and not bent), but if they were, the arc tube would be impossible to get into the lamp's outer bulb
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ITT Low Pressure Sodium NEMA


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Sep 21, 2012 at 02:07 PM Author: icefoglights
It would be cool to see that lit! I'm guessing the arc would spin as it follows the current, though you'd probably need a high speed camera to see it.

01010010 01101111 01100010 01100101 01110010 01110100

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Sep 21, 2012 at 04:16 PM Author: Ash
It would spin indeed. With the added benefits of very reduced flicker (quite flicker-free) and no need to restrike the arc at zero crossing as it would probably never go off
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Sep 21, 2012 at 04:59 PM Author: AngryHorse
Thats incredible!!

Current: UK 230V, 50Hz
Power provider: e.on energy
Street lighting in our town: Philips UniStreet LED

"Beauty fades, dumb is forever".......Judge Judy Cheesy

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Sep 21, 2012 at 06:29 PM Author: Globe Collector
Ash, I need to explain something to dor123, some spectra related stuff, can you translate form English to Hebrew if I P.M. it to you, then pass it on to him?. Dor uses some srot of software package to do this, but I don't think it translates technical stuff very well.
He even seems to have the "wrong end of the stick" with his comment on this lamp, I don't think he understands three phase supplies very well or that Stan has only lit it on single phase as a quick demo for us all to see.

Manufactured articles should be made to be used, not made to be sold!

Fee, Fye, Fow, Fum, A dead man's eye and a parrot's BUM!

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USA (120V 60HZ)


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Sep 21, 2012 at 06:50 PM Author: Alights
Very impressive lamp probably the most special i have seen
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Sep 22, 2012 at 02:43 AM Author: Ash
Globe Collector - no problem
randacnam7321
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Sep 29, 2012 at 05:29 PM Author: randacnam7321
What we use for residential and light commercial electricity is properly called single phase center tap. Real 2 phase has hots that are 90° out of phase with each other. It is almost never used nowadays as 3 phase is much easier to design systems for.

Old school FTW!

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Sep 29, 2012 at 05:59 PM Author: Ash
There is 4 wire system like that, but its more like 4 live wires (at 90 deg) with no neutral
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Dec 21, 2014 at 10:39 PM Author: DetroitTwoStroke
Wow, that is a very interesting lamp!

Pride and quality workmanship should lie behind manufacturing, not greed.

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^homebuilt fixture


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Dec 21, 2014 at 11:14 PM Author: xmaslightguy
Wow thats a really cool find!!

Colored Fluorescent's such as F40T12 Red or  Green or Blue are awesome...

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