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Modified Fixture For 30 Inch Appliance Lamp

Modified Fixture For 30 Inch Appliance Lamp

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These F30"T12 lamps are designated as 21w and I have no idea the proper ballast. However, I have chopped a rusted old 40w RS fixture into this as shown and installed a Valmont HPF 2x20w trigger-start, aka, rapid-start ballast, shunted for one of these lamps. It seems to work fine so far but I haven't measured lamp current yet. Total line wattage (w/ballast losses) is 33w so I would guess lamp is a little over-driven running at least 25w but looks normal brightness for a T12 with at least 80~90% ballast factor.

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Album name:don93s / Various Lights
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Keywords:Lamps
File Size:343 KB
Date added:Sep 04, 2015
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Date Time:2015:09:04 22:22:04
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Solanaceae
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Sep 04, 2015 at 10:33 PM Author: Solanaceae
Nice work, Don. I did a similar project to a beaten up f40 wraparound.

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Sep 04, 2015 at 10:41 PM Author: don93s
Thanks...yeah I liked the wraparound you did! I've been taking an interest in some of these old odd size appliance lamps recently. But getting good info on older style lamps online is a bit tough. Sometimes it seems google is worthless for any good research these days.
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^homebuilt fixture


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Sep 04, 2015 at 10:42 PM Author: xmaslightguy
Nice mod
One of these days I need to make myself a 2-lamp version of this.

Colored Fluorescent's such as F40T12 Red or  Green or Blue are awesome...

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GoL Solanaceae.Keif.Fitz Keif Fitz bubby_keif
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Sep 04, 2015 at 11:07 PM Author: Solanaceae
Don, I may be interested in those f25t12/33" warm white tubes, all I gotta do is find a cheep fixture to chop.

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themaritimegirl themaritimegirl themaritimegirl
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Sep 05, 2015 at 04:49 PM Author: themaritimegirl
Nice job! Yeah, I've never found any info on the F30"T12. I guess you'd just have to test it at various currents, and measure the arc voltage, and multiply it all by 0.85 until you get something close to 21W.

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Sep 05, 2015 at 05:30 PM Author: streetlight98
Nice! This may sound like an odd question, but how do you guys go about "chopping" the fixtures? Sawzall?

Please check out my newly-updated website! McCann Lighting Company is where my street light collection is displayed in detail.

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GoL Solanaceae.Keif.Fitz Keif Fitz bubby_keif
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Sep 05, 2015 at 05:37 PM Author: Solanaceae
For me, I use a hacksaw. I initially thought of using a circular or table saw, but I was unsure of the proper blade to use. Maybe I'll ask my shop teacher on tuesdee.

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Sep 05, 2015 at 06:10 PM Author: Alights
Nice creation ! I've got some odd size HO lamps i should build fixtures for like F42T12's
Band saws with the continous loop belt works very well,I bought one for these kinda projects buy I'm also thinking of purchasing a dremmel to chop in tight spaces
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Sep 05, 2015 at 07:09 PM Author: streetlight98
Ah I have a hack saw. I'd have to find a fixture with endplates that screw on, since I'd just have to drill the holes for the screws. Maybe I'll chop a fixture I find and make an F13T5 shoplight that way. I'd like to make a two-lamp F13T5 shoplight.

Please check out my newly-updated website! McCann Lighting Company is where my street light collection is displayed in detail.

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GoL Solanaceae.Keif.Fitz Keif Fitz bubby_keif
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Sep 05, 2015 at 07:16 PM Author: Solanaceae
I saw some flimsy f40 shoplites at hab, with an 80s blue text white background label, made in Mexico. I'll get the three at hab next week.

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Sep 05, 2015 at 07:19 PM Author: streetlight98
Could possibly be Genlyte-Thomas or Lithonia. I think G-T made pretty sturdy fixtures though. Lithonia started cheapening out their fixture bodies in the 80s and 90s and then recently in the past several years cheapened out their ballasts by using AccuPro POS ballasts. They were using Sylvania ballasts for awhile and those are awesome ballasts. My 2006 Lithonia troffer has a Sylvania ballast.

Please check out my newly-updated website! McCann Lighting Company is where my street light collection is displayed in detail.

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Sep 05, 2015 at 07:57 PM Author: don93s
The main tools I use in mods are a medium size band saw (which I was lucky to acquire from work, my boss said, 'take it home'; it had to be fixed/rebuilt), definitely a dremel kit, a small 4" belt sander, cordless drill, set of drill bits, and misc. stuff like flat/round files, blocks of steel for flattening a part of fixture, measuring tape, and cheap set of dial calipers.

@Solanaceae, I'll definitely hold those 25w lamps for you.
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GoL Solanaceae.Keif.Fitz Keif Fitz bubby_keif
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Sep 05, 2015 at 08:11 PM Author: Solanaceae
Thanks, Don. Sadly, my dremmel went up in smoke a few weeks ago.

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Sep 05, 2015 at 08:22 PM Author: don93s
Ugh! Sorry to hear that. I don't really use mine all that often (though it was definitely needed for the above project) and try to go easy on it as it can get hot if I let it scream at high rpm for long periods. I usually use the least rpm's needed to do the job. I've had that thing for probably over 15 years, lol.
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Sep 05, 2015 at 08:31 PM Author: Solanaceae
Mine was bought new last year. Still works, but needs a wire to be re soldered and new varnish on the rotor and the motor outer coil.

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Sep 05, 2015 at 08:58 PM Author: don93s
Usually if a coil smokes, it's too late for varnish, at least from my experience.

@TheMaritimeMan, I just made some measurements with the installed ballast:

Lamp Current: .375a
Lamp Voltage: 71v

I'm actually pretty happy with this existing set-up. I also have plenty of spares, lol.
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Sep 05, 2015 at 09:14 PM Author: themaritimegirl
That's actually pretty much spot on. Official spec is likely 70V by 0.375 or 0.38A, then. I assume it has no krypton since it's working just fine on trigger start.

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Sep 05, 2015 at 09:19 PM Author: don93s
Yeah, it doesn't exhibit any krypton behavior, unlike the F25T12-33's I have. It starts very easily. The voltage seems pretty consistent with the length for an argon fill too.
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Sep 05, 2015 at 09:27 PM Author: themaritimegirl
Intriguing. That makes me wonder why the F25T12 ever needed krypton. I know even the 28" variant has krypton, but you'd think then that they'd let it have its natural arc voltage and slightly lower current. Since the F25T12 runs at the same current as the 34 watt F40T12, maybe they actually decided to just use 34 watt cathodes rather than coming up with new cathodes? Then again, the 34 watt lamps are technically rapid start only... who knows!

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Sep 05, 2015 at 09:31 PM Author: don93s
Those 25w appliance lamps have had me baffled for some time, personally! Then this 21w version comes along....
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Sep 05, 2015 at 10:35 PM Author: don93s
@Trent, I just did some more tests. I used my last 25w ballast (it's actually .40a Universal, the rest I bought are all used in 20w fixtures) starting with an F25T12WW-33. It was a little stubborn to start on a wooden table with no grounded metal surface...

Current: .41a
Lamp Voltage: 64.3v

I then tried the above shown F30"T12 which started on first blink of the starter:

Current: .38a
Lamp Voltage: 70v

I then tried three more F30"T12 from another batch of manufacture represented by the third lamp down in another pic I posted and that's when things get weird...

First try...
Current: .25a
Lamp Voltage: 84v
After a few minutes, lamp voltage shot up to over 100v, dimmed and went out. Then it just blinked on starter. After lamp cooled down:

Second try...
Current:.35a
Lamp Voltage: 75v
It seemed stable for a few minutes but I moved on to the next lamp:

First try...
Current .33a
Voltage: 78v
After a few minutes, same thing. Over 100 volts, went out.

Second try...
Current: .32a
Lamp Voltage: 82v

Third lamp wouldn't start so I put it in HPF trigger start with 202ocv. Start-up was very slow and after full brightness, the voltage steadily climbed up to over 212v! Lamp started to 'rectify' or fast flicker and Line current hit 83w before I shut it down. I'll need more time to see what's going on, lol. Could be impurities or some sort of defect. I've seen batches of Sylvania F40 and even F15T8 do similar weird things when 'breaking in' and eventually stabilize.
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Sep 05, 2015 at 10:58 PM Author: themaritimegirl
Wow, that's very strange! Maybe a prolonged run on an electronic ballast will sort out the ones acting up.

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^homebuilt fixture


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Sep 05, 2015 at 11:02 PM Author: xmaslightguy
For cutting fixtures I've used (depending on size & thickness of the fixture):
Circular saw with a metal cutting blade.
Dremel tool.
Tin snips.

--------
Interesting test results don93s.
I'd say with that one try TheMaritimeMan's thought of an electronic ballast, that or a 2xF40T12 HPF (with the 2nd lamp being anything from a F40 to a F40)

Colored Fluorescent's such as F40T12 Red or  Green or Blue are awesome...

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Sep 06, 2015 at 10:47 AM Author: don93s
@xmaslightguy, oh yeah...I forgot about the tin snips. A decent pair can be very useful!

@Trent, due to the ridiculous operating voltage of that last lamp, I've an idea for long-term testing with NPF slimline ballast.
Excessive lamp voltage can kill electronic ballasts and can also be stressful on HPF magnetic, as the HPF trigger start was pulling 83 watts which would seem to fry the primary eventually.

I have a pair of Universal NPF one-lamp F42T6 ballasts I can connect in parallel to get full T12 lamp current, OCV of 450v, and can tolerate high/unstable lamp voltages. I'll let you know what I find out.
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Sep 06, 2015 at 11:15 AM Author: themaritimegirl
Nice. I actually didn't know LPF slimline ballasts existed!

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Sep 06, 2015 at 12:37 PM Author: don93s
Yeah, they turn up on ebay occasionally. I could tell mine were NPF when I bought them because the line current is listed as .90a which is double what they normally are. For a while I had them doubled up to power a F96T12 slimlime in my garage. Lamp ran at around 330ma and surprisingly, it always worked fine even the most severe cold conditions, albeit dim, lol. It did have trouble starting energy savers though.
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Sep 06, 2015 at 02:15 PM Author: ace100w120v
Were LPF F96 slimlines ever made? Can you describe what it did with the energy-saver slimlines?

Ah, the smell of burnt electric motor or alternator...it's a smell you'll never forget!
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Sep 06, 2015 at 07:01 PM Author: don93s
@ace, I'm not aware of NPF F96 slimline ballast, and I did sort of look for one but no evidence of any. The closest, however, is a Lead-Lag ballast and only use the lag side. I have one and let me tell you...if you put an EOL lamp on the lag side, not only will it rectify, but will completely melt away the electrode! That thing is brutal.

As for the paralleled F42T6 ballasts, the 60w energy saver lamps wouldn't fire up at all. I didn't spend much time on that....probably could have got them to work. My guess is they would be closer to the proper current than the 75w lamp because of lower lamp voltage on energy savers with NPF ballast. I doubt it would have hurt ballast though. But the krypton fill makes lamps need higher starting voltage.
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