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Generic LED panel with a built in driver, about to fall inside a store at the Cinemall mall

Generic LED panel with a built in driver, about to fall inside a store at the Cinemall mall

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The PCB on the side of the panel, is what drives the LED strip inside the panel. I hope that it would eventually fall to the ground.

IMG_2624.JPG IMG_2623.JPG IMG_2618.JPG IMG_2596.JPG

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Filename:IMG_2618.JPG
Album name:dor123 / LED lighting (Except road lanterns), LEDs in general, lasers, flashlights and other lighting gadgets
Keywords:Lanterns
File Size:449 KB
Date added:Jan 13, 2017
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Date Time:2017:01:12 18:47:23
DateTime Original:2017:01:12 18:47:23
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rjluna2
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Robert


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Jan 13, 2017 at 06:17 AM Author: rjluna2
How about poor workmanship on the fitting of this fixture?

Pretty, please no more Chinese failure.

BC5-80
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Jan 13, 2017 at 06:27 AM Author: BC5-80
Well photographed, dor123. That workmanship is appalling. It even looks as though they've left out the earth connection. That driver surprises me as well. I would have expected something more substantial. It looks nothing more than the inverter you might find on a fluorescent camping lantern.

Cathode shields promote boring fluorescents.

dor123
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Jan 13, 2017 at 07:05 AM Author: dor123
This is totally different than the inverter of fluorescent emergency lighting, as there is no need for HV here, and in the case of a brownout or driver EOL, this panel would flash.

I"m don't speak English well, and rely on online translating to write in this site.
Please forgive me if my choice of my words looks like offensive, while that isn't my intention.

I only working with the European date format (dd.mm.yyyy).

I lives in Israel, which is a 230-240V, 50hz country.

Ash
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Jan 13, 2017 at 07:15 AM Author: Ash
Many recessed luminaires come with a terminal box for the input cable, that contains a terminal, a cable clamp (for strain relief) and is closed with a cover

In this one the driver is combined with the terminal box to save costs - the terminal is one of those terminals assembled directly on the PCB, and they both are under one cover (not even separate covers for the wire and the terminal). You can see that the wires dont go under the cable clamp : This terminal box is designed to be connected to thin 3x0.5 flex, probably thats what they use to wire those in China. The 3x1.5 N2xY cable used here (and which should be used, and which all Fluorescent luminaires accept properly) cant fit in this pathetic thing, definitely not with the cover on (without breaking all the end of the box open). The installers chose to not put the cover on, while the correct thing to do would be to throw all those panels out of the window (or atleast, connect them with short piece of flex, spliced with the proper cable in a separate box, doubling the labor it takes to install those, and still probably would not be code compliant)

Stuff like this is why workers who do work in drop ceilings get shocks. Even a simple action like lifting a nearby ceiling tile and hitting one of the leads of the capacitor is sufficient. And there go IT, fire alarm and CCTV guys that try to fish their cables thorugh the ceiling where something like that is hiding behind the corner
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105555521242365640724 UCM30tBQDUECOV6VeG5W87Vg zfarmadillo
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Jan 13, 2017 at 10:08 AM Author: Lumex120
Gawd, I cannot believe that the driver isn't even enclosed. Is this what 90% of commercial LED "retrofits" are like around there? I wont be surprised if that thing falls and kills someone.

Any machine is a smoke machine if you operate it wrong enough.

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Jan 13, 2017 at 12:59 PM Author: Ash
Usually isnt that bad, but terminals are often left open because there is simply no way to splice N2xY (heavy cable with thick isolation) into the tiny Chenese devices designed for cable of the size of USB cable
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xelareverse UCjohSkrTwJJJzpc_r8D3vKw xelareverse
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Jan 13, 2017 at 02:41 PM Author: xelareverse

LED Toobs minus Too equals LED bs

Potato

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Jan 13, 2017 at 07:51 PM Author: xmaslightguy
It does look like there should be a cover over the connection, but then the board would still be left exposed
What a crappy little thing. This should be *inside* the fitting/fixture ... and it should have a proper cable connection (plus assuming the its made of metal not plastic, the fitting/fixture should deff be grounded. No way would this pass an electrical inspection here)

--
I would assume the frame is attached to the actual structural ceiling above so it won't fall? (then again maybe not, looking at the wiring job)

Colored Fluorescent's such as F40T12 Red or  Green or Blue are awesome...

Ash
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Jan 14, 2017 at 03:26 AM Author: Ash
There was a cover on this one covering the entire module (the board + cable connection), the sparkies threw it out as there is simply no way to close it over the connection (box is too tiny)

Those drivers are supposed to be SELV, in which case the thing does not need Earth connection. How safe they really are with the flimsy plastic backing separating the PCB from the metal, cheap isolation in the transformer, and questionable clearances in the PCB between the 230V and output areas - unknown

Most LED drivers for recessed lights are a separate module. But usually it is really separate, as in - there is a length of flex connecting it to the light panel, so it is not attached to the luminaire but is freely thrown in the ceiling space, and usually have a bit better enclosure that does not fall apart by itself

But they all are impossible or nearly impossible to install in a code compliant way, because they are all designed with Chinese code and not Western code in mind (so the size of terminals vs. size of cables we use here, inadequate size of strain relief clamps, of boxes etc)

Troffers are required to be connected to the structural ceiling with Steel bands, and are - when proper installation is done. LED panels uaually dont have any place to attach the band to, but most LED panels are by far more lightweight than Fluorescents, so the load they put on the ceiling grid is not that big (though if it still falls down, an Aluminum LED panel can injure very severely, while a simple ceiling tile cannot). I dont know about LED "box lights" like this one, the flat tiles are never connected for what i know

Inspecion ? The problem is, the ones who call for inspections are the same ones who call for the "energy saving projects" in the 1st place. So they would push to mark everything as "passed" just so there isnt anything wrong (officially) with their awesome green upgrade
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Jan 14, 2017 at 10:50 AM Author: BC5-80
I see there is a rudimentary cable clamp there but the two wires bypass it, sitting above it. Perhaps that's why they didn't bother putting the cover on. If they can't be bothered to use the cable clamp they certainly won't bother to use the cover. What a load of .......... This evidence should be delivered to the establishment to make them aware of the shoddy botchmanship that's been perpetrated on their premises. If they don't take it seriously, threaten to go public.

Cathode shields promote boring fluorescents.

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Jan 14, 2017 at 12:11 PM Author: Ash
The clamp gotta go over the outer isolation of the cable, not over the inner wires. The clamp is too small, it cannot be closed over 3x1.5mm^2 NYY anyway

The only option to connect it decently is to add a short jumper of 0.5mm^2 flex from this thing to an additional box and splice it with the cable there. Dont expect cheap sparkies to go that far to correct the flaws of a cheap Chinese product.... Most of them would at most just break the entire clamp away, break a big hole in that end of the box, and close the cover over the cable without any strain relief. When the cable will be pulled, the entire driver box will disintegrate
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Jan 15, 2017 at 12:24 AM Author: xmaslightguy
@Ash
Interesting that LED drivers for recessed lights are a separate part, (but yeah I totally see something like that just being freely thrown in the open ceiling space)
The one LED recessed light I saw here... A troffer, The display model looked exactly like its fluorescent equivalent - infact I think they just used the existing design and instead of fluorescent "guts" it had LED (driver was probably in the ballast channel.)
There was one box sitting in the store aisle where a corner of the box was damaged, as was the fixture itself, there was a small hole broken in the diffuser panel so I could see just alittle inside...I woulda loved to open that thing up & have a good look inside. (who knows, maybe it'll end up cheap on the clearance shelf LOL)

I've seen flat panel LED units too, but they were flush mounted - and looked like they were designed to be (again as part of a store display), although they did look like they were also meant so they could fit in a tile ceiling as well. I just assumed the driver was integrated (or it was a driver-less unit), what you said makes me wonder if maybe there was a separate module just thrown up above the display shelf

Colored Fluorescent's such as F40T12 Red or  Green or Blue are awesome...

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Jan 15, 2017 at 04:00 AM Author: suzukir122
Very, very, very, very, very, VERY poor installation. I say, let gravity do the work. The fixture is garbage anyways

Interests
1. Motorcycles, Women, and Lighting (especially fluorescent)
2. Weighting/staying extremely athletic
3. Severe Thunderstorms of all kinds
4. Food and drinks. So gimme them bbq ribs
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rjluna2
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Jan 15, 2017 at 06:23 PM Author: rjluna2
That is fitting, suzukir122

Pretty, please no more Chinese failure.

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Jan 15, 2017 at 06:36 PM Author: suzukir122
These fixtures are literally YELLING the word hazard.

Interests
1. Motorcycles, Women, and Lighting (especially fluorescent)
2. Weighting/staying extremely athletic
3. Severe Thunderstorms of all kinds
4. Food and drinks. So gimme them bbq ribs
Yep
Lighting has been a passion of mine since I was born. I consider everyone on LG to be a friend

dor123
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Feb 24, 2017 at 03:20 AM Author: dor123
Update: The shop, finally arranged the panels:

I"m don't speak English well, and rely on online translating to write in this site.
Please forgive me if my choice of my words looks like offensive, while that isn't my intention.

I only working with the European date format (dd.mm.yyyy).

I lives in Israel, which is a 230-240V, 50hz country.

xmaslightguy
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Feb 24, 2017 at 09:05 AM Author: xmaslightguy
Looks better (and safer ) with that one fixed... but if you look along the strip, you can see the fixtures are not even in a straight line (which looks crap to me .lol.)
That space is obviously just a bit over 2-feet and no crosspieces between the fixtures (so incorrectly built). No wonder the one light had partially fallen out.

Colored Fluorescent's such as F40T12 Red or  Green or Blue are awesome...

suzukir122
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suzukir123
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Feb 24, 2017 at 10:52 AM Author: suzukir122
This looks like someone in 3rd grade managed to arrange this by himself but was angry about the fact that he failed math class and got NO MORE HELP.
In other words, this is some of the worst installation arrangement I've seen in a long time. But hey, at least they've got all of the panels
working somehow. But there is absolutely no way that these will last. Whether they come crashing down, or they reach EOL. One
of the two is guaranteed to happen

Interests
1. Motorcycles, Women, and Lighting (especially fluorescent)
2. Weighting/staying extremely athletic
3. Severe Thunderstorms of all kinds
4. Food and drinks. So gimme them bbq ribs
Yep
Lighting has been a passion of mine since I was born. I consider everyone on LG to be a friend

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