11   Lamps / Modern / Re: Why so many LED lamps not for enclosed fixtures?  on: May 27, 2024, 06:41:25 AM 
Started by Cole D. - Last post by Medved
The main thing not so many people take into account is, the incandescent emit majority of the "heat" as a rather short wavelength IR (very close the visible range), which passes through the glass ciovr the same way as the visible does, so only fraction of that power actually stays within the fixture.
Compare to that, the fluorescents, as well as LEDs, emit most of their waste heat as convection heat and long wave IR, which both remain trapped inside.
So although there is e.g. a 100W incandescent, in a fully enclosed glass globe just about 20..25W of heat trapped inside of the fixture.
The same fixture with a 70lm/W 25W CFL (to get similar ~1800lm output), all the losses, so about 20W is dissipated within the globe. Nearly the same as with the 100W incandescent, so leading to similar internal temperature. And that higher temperature is way easier to handle by the incandescent, than the CFL ballast. And also the performance of the tube itself is quite temperature sensitive, it must be specifically designed for the temperatures it is supposed to work at. So it may be possible to design a tube for enclosed fixture operation, such lamp will be very inefficient at lower temperatures (in open fixtures; and also take forever to warm up to ramp up the light output). Because it is easier to work with lower temperatures of open fixtures and many fixtures are indeed open, it is the condition these lamps are designed for.
 
With ~150lm/W LEDs you need about 12W power input, which means about 7W dissipated as heat. It is way less than the CFL (or incandescent), but the plug-in LEDs have extremely tight thermal budget (because there is minimum chance to get rid of the heat, even when there is less of it), so most hsuch higher power LEDs use to be "just on the edge" with an open fixture operation. So very likely will operate beyond its design target, so suffer from worse reliability (every 10degC higher temperature means about halving its lifetime).
 12   General / General Discussion / Re: Interesting effect....  on: May 27, 2024, 06:19:59 AM 
Started by sol - Last post by Medved
 "flickering at 30 HZ"
If they are really flickering at 30Hz (or anything else than 2x the main frequency, so 100 or 120Hz depends on where you are), there is something really bad with the lights, anything other than a "double-mains" frequency can not be any intended design feature (such as intentionally not using an electrolytic capacitor, single stage high power factor driver,...).

Very often it is LED string just failing (some bond wire just broke and is thermally cycling - that uses to be in the 10's Hz range).

Or there is something happening in the electrical installation (some arcing on a loose connection in the lighting circuit), or some crazy SCR regulation of some very high load.
Some permanent magnet synchronous motor starters use to do that - as they connect the mains only at times when the rotor happens to be in a correct phase vs the mains to accelerate it, but once it reaches synchronicity with mains it should remain permanently ON, so they should do the chopping only for very brief time to start the motor, after that it should remain permanently ON. Could be when the motor is overloaded, it never reaches synchronicity so the starter never transitions into the permanent ON "run" state and continue bursting.
This concept is quite popular on things like fixed speed blowers or pumps (e.g. dish washer circulation pumps commonly use this concept). It allows to use high efficiency, yet simple permanent magnet AC synchronous motors with way less complexity than a complete VFD, the drawback is the strong subharmonic current draw during startup, which may cause some lights in the installation to flicker.

Or it could be some mechanical fault on some motor, causing uneven mechanical load, so pulsing into the current draw. Again those high efficiency permanent magnet motors use to be more sensitive to this, but induction motors do that too.
 13   General / General Discussion / Re: Article on “ purple street lights”.  on: May 27, 2024, 03:10:44 AM 
Started by Ugly1 - Last post by Richmond2000
Winnipeg got a call out and the pics look like the autobahn ATB0 that done turned blue in peg city
there was one on my route home I was watching slowly turn blue over a 1 year period and was 1/2 way transitioned when the supply failed and hydro in there usual have not done anything with it
last fall I happened to see it day burning and could look up at it running and see that the chips on the edge where blue with most of the ones in the centre of the assembly still white and it was an all or nothing on the chip part
 14   Lanterns/Fixtures / Modern / Re: Commercial style post top fixtures being used residentially  on: May 27, 2024, 02:36:36 AM 
Started by Cole D. - Last post by Richmond2000
in my town they are using post top lanterns in the newer neighborhoods for residential street lighting and Westinghouse / Eaton Vanguard ballast in arm fixtures are common for rural yard / driveway lighting
there is a house near me that has a 35/55 watt SOX street light fixture mounted post top facing sideways to light up there 1980's "architectural" home
https://maps.app.goo.gl/YaCcD3itF4WKeUzg8
 15   General / Off-Topic / Re: Who makes the best small engine?  on: May 27, 2024, 02:34:26 AM 
Started by HIDLad001 - Last post by LightsoftheWest
I would say Honda as well. My elderly neighbor has an old Honda string trimmer from 1995 that had been sitting in her garage for over 10 years. When I went to start it up, it still somewhat ran. Replaced the carburetor, and now it works like the day it did from day 1.

Our Toro walk-behind lawn mower has a Tecumseh engine in it.  Never gave us any problems despite that its oil had never been changed in its 15 years until a few months ago.
 16   General / Off-Topic / Who do you think makes the best gas-powered yard equipment?  on: May 27, 2024, 02:06:13 AM 
Started by LightsoftheWest - Last post by LightsoftheWest
I'm just curious about which brand of gas-powered yard equipment, such as blowers, string trimmers, chainsaws, walk-behind lawn mowers, etc. Stihl used to be my favorite, but about five years ago, their quality went downhill very fast. Now, it's a tie between either Honda or Maruyama. I just finished replacing the carburetor in my neighbor's Honda string trimmer from 1995. It still starts on the first or second pull and runs like new. I've never used Maruyama equipment, but from what it sounds like, their quality is second to none and they still manufacture everything in Japan. I've heard Echo/Shindaiwa is excellent as well.
 17   Lanterns/Fixtures / Modern / Re: Commercial style post top fixtures being used residentially  on: May 27, 2024, 12:39:51 AM 
Started by Cole D. - Last post by Cole D.
I just remembered another house I went to one time. It was out in the country, set pretty far off the road. It had some more of those commercial type post type fixtures, in black. These were on tall poles though, about what height you’d see for a utility installation, whereas a lot of the HID post top-in-residential installs I see put them at a lower height.

I just looked up the place on Streetview, and these weren’t GE Town and Country, they look more like Cooper Traditionaire models.

The place didn’t look very old, I’d say late 2000s era or so, so probably HPS units.
 18   General / General Discussion / Re: What did you do today lighting wise?  on: May 26, 2024, 11:07:28 PM 
Started by RyanF40T12 - Last post by BT25
Worked on the restoration of a Westinghouse Silverliner 250W/S50 OV15...
 19   General / General Discussion / Article on “ purple street lights”.  on: May 26, 2024, 07:38:31 PM 
Started by Ugly1 - Last post by Ugly1
The latest edition of “Inside Lighting Infoletter” web site  has an in depth article entitled” Investigating The Purple Light
Phenomenon In LED Street Lights”. Interesting conclusions.
 20   General / General Discussion / Re: Dreams about lighting and their frustrations LOL  on: May 26, 2024, 07:30:20 PM 
Started by Lightingguy1994 - Last post by Lightingguy1994
Check ebay regularly, and also the web finds board here on LG. Low wattage MV appears from time to time for very good prices, most of mine have been from ebay.

If you live in a 230v country, one option you have is to import a 12v pure sine wave inverter that does 120v and run it off either a deep cycle battery or a strong 12v power supply and you'll be able to run the North American lamps and gear which might be more common to find online.

Rommie does this I believe. This works best if you intend to have your lamp set up as a demonstration and of course only attempt if you can do so safely.

For 40/50 watt mv, a 39w magnetic mh ballast works a treat with ignitor removed.
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