Running European 80w MV lamps on American 100w H38 HX MV ballasts « on: November 07, 2020, 03:33:03 AM » Author: WorldwideHIDCollectorUSA
According to my understanding, US 100w H38 MV lamps have an operating current of 0.8a and an arc voltage of 130v while European 80w MV lamps also have an operating current of 0.8a. However, European 80w MV lamps have a arc voltage of 115v. I wonder if it is safe to run European 80w MV lamps on US 100w H38 HX ballasts. I understand that HX ballasts seem to be more tolerable to different lamp arc voltages compared to CWA ballasts which are extremely selective of specific lamps since they often require certain lamps to have certain arc voltages and currents.
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Desire to collect various light bulbs (especially HID), control gear, and fixtures from around the world.

DISCLAIMER: THE EXPERIMENTS THAT I CONDUCT INVOLVING UNUSUAL LAMP/BALLAST COMBINATIONS SHOULD NOT BE ATTEMPTED UNLESS YOU HAVE THE PROPER KNOWLEDGE. I AM NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR ANY INJURIES.

	Re: Running European 80w MV lamps on American 100w H38 HX MV ballasts « Reply #1 on: November 08, 2020, 01:07:09 AM » Author: Medved
You are wrong. 100W MV are 0.95A lamps (the H38), so the 80W (0.8A) would be overloaded. Arc voltages are around 105..110V for both 80 and 100W lamps. 130V is only for tye higher power, like 250W or so.
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	Re: Running European 80w MV lamps on American 100w H38 HX MV ballasts « Reply #2 on: November 08, 2020, 01:09:06 AM » Author: WorldwideHIDCollectorUSA
I wonder why some people claim that US 100w H38 MV lamps run at 0.8a instead of 0.95a.
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Desire to collect various light bulbs (especially HID), control gear, and fixtures from around the world.

DISCLAIMER: THE EXPERIMENTS THAT I CONDUCT INVOLVING UNUSUAL LAMP/BALLAST COMBINATIONS SHOULD NOT BE ATTEMPTED UNLESS YOU HAVE THE PROPER KNOWLEDGE. I AM NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR ANY INJURIES.

	Re: Running European 80w MV lamps on American 100w H38 HX MV ballasts « Reply #3 on: November 08, 2020, 02:45:55 AM » Author: Medved
Well they maybe "run", but underpowered... I've seen plenty of 80W MVs put into 70W HPS ballast (Europe, so 70W HPS are 1A) and were surprized they fail (lost output) early...
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	Re: Running European 80w MV lamps on American 100w H38 HX MV ballasts « Reply #4 on: November 08, 2020, 02:48:33 AM » Author: WorldwideHIDCollectorUSA
I imagine that paralleling 2 F40T12 preheat ballasts might work. Do you know if it is true?
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Desire to collect various light bulbs (especially HID), control gear, and fixtures from around the world.

DISCLAIMER: THE EXPERIMENTS THAT I CONDUCT INVOLVING UNUSUAL LAMP/BALLAST COMBINATIONS SHOULD NOT BE ATTEMPTED UNLESS YOU HAVE THE PROPER KNOWLEDGE. I AM NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR ANY INJURIES.

	Re: Running European 80w MV lamps on American 100w H38 HX MV ballasts « Reply #5 on: November 08, 2020, 02:50:58 AM » Author: WorldwideHIDCollectorUSA
Quote from: Medved on November 08, 2020, 01:07:09 AM You are wrong. 100W MV are 0.95A lamps (the H38), so the 80W (0.8A) would be overloaded. Arc voltages are around 105..110V for both 80 and 100W lamps. 130V is only for tye higher power, like 250W or so. How many hours should I expect from operating European  80w MV lamps on US 100w H38 HX ballasts? Would my H38 HX ballast suffer any damage from long term use of European 80w MV lamps on it?
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Desire to collect various light bulbs (especially HID), control gear, and fixtures from around the world.

DISCLAIMER: THE EXPERIMENTS THAT I CONDUCT INVOLVING UNUSUAL LAMP/BALLAST COMBINATIONS SHOULD NOT BE ATTEMPTED UNLESS YOU HAVE THE PROPER KNOWLEDGE. I AM NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR ANY INJURIES.

	Re: Running European 80w MV lamps on American 100w H38 HX MV ballasts « Reply #6 on: November 08, 2020, 03:43:19 AM » Author: Medved
Quote from: WorldwideHIDCollectorUSA on November 08, 2020, 02:50:58 AM How many hours should I expect from operating European  80w MV lamps on US 100w H38 HX ballasts? Would my H38 HX ballast suffer any damage from long term use of European 80w MV lamps on it? It varies, depends on how much margin the given design has. Some are pushed really to the limits (in order to get as high efficacy as possible) so they fail in matter of few 10's hours when overloaded that way. Some designs are known to last 10 years even when nearly doubling the curent. Better to avoid. Two F40T12 ballasts in parallel will still be overloading it, but by far not that much as the H38. If you are looking for an European lamp, better take the 125W and run it on the H38. It will be 15% uderdriven, which is still safe (a bit lower than rated efficacy, but I guess you won't care that much for that here)
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	Re: Running European 80w MV lamps on American 100w H38 HX MV ballasts « Reply #7 on: November 08, 2020, 03:47:43 AM » Author: WorldwideHIDCollectorUSA
I have seen some sources citing that US 100w H38 MV lamps run at 0.85a and 130v. That was sourced from one of the Sylvania Engineering bulletins for MV lamps. Here is the PDF where I sourced the information for: https://media.distributordatasolutions.com/Sylvania/v1/files/File_Technical_Document_-_High_Intensity_Discharge_MERCURY_Lamps_69408.pdf You can find the lamp voltage and current table on page 7 of this PDF. With this information, should a 80w MV lamp would only be overdriven by 6% more amps and 13% more arc volts. I do not see how a European 80w MV lamp would quickly burn out on US 100w H38 MV HX ballasts.
« Last Edit: November 08, 2020, 03:58:23 AM by WorldwideHIDCollectorUSA »		Logged

Desire to collect various light bulbs (especially HID), control gear, and fixtures from around the world.

DISCLAIMER: THE EXPERIMENTS THAT I CONDUCT INVOLVING UNUSUAL LAMP/BALLAST COMBINATIONS SHOULD NOT BE ATTEMPTED UNLESS YOU HAVE THE PROPER KNOWLEDGE. I AM NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR ANY INJURIES.

	Re: Running European 80w MV lamps on American 100w H38 HX MV ballasts « Reply #8 on: November 08, 2020, 06:19:40 AM » Author: Medved
Definitely the final say has the A-meter in series with the lamp... But I would not operate the MV above 105% of its current rationg, better to look for some lower current possibility.
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	Re: Running European 80w MV lamps on American 100w H38 HX MV ballasts « Reply #9 on: November 08, 2020, 06:49:54 AM » Author: WorldwideHIDCollectorUSA
Quote from: Medved on November 08, 2020, 06:19:40 AM Definitely the final say has the A-meter in series with the lamp... But I would not operate the MV above 105% of its current rationg, better to look for some lower current possibility. I feel that this bulb should be fine anyhow like you see how some fluorescent chokes are often rated for multiple types of fluorescent lamps. These should only be a slight reduction in life and not by thousands of hours for just a few tens of milliamps.
« Last Edit: November 08, 2020, 06:52:45 AM by WorldwideHIDCollectorUSA »		Logged

Desire to collect various light bulbs (especially HID), control gear, and fixtures from around the world.

DISCLAIMER: THE EXPERIMENTS THAT I CONDUCT INVOLVING UNUSUAL LAMP/BALLAST COMBINATIONS SHOULD NOT BE ATTEMPTED UNLESS YOU HAVE THE PROPER KNOWLEDGE. I AM NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR ANY INJURIES.

	Re: Running European 80w MV lamps on American 100w H38 HX MV ballasts « Reply #10 on: November 08, 2020, 07:39:08 AM » Author: WorldwideHIDCollectorUSA
Why do people claim that all HID lamps have their lives drastically affected when being slightly overdriven by like 105%? I see that many slightly overdriven fluorescent lamps seem to last their rated life. I feel that I am told that 80w MV lamps must NEVER BE USED ON US 100w H38 MV ballasts because someone says they will instantly burn out
« Last Edit: November 08, 2020, 07:51:28 AM by WorldwideHIDCollectorUSA »		Logged

Desire to collect various light bulbs (especially HID), control gear, and fixtures from around the world.

DISCLAIMER: THE EXPERIMENTS THAT I CONDUCT INVOLVING UNUSUAL LAMP/BALLAST COMBINATIONS SHOULD NOT BE ATTEMPTED UNLESS YOU HAVE THE PROPER KNOWLEDGE. I AM NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR ANY INJURIES.

	Re: Running European 80w MV lamps on American 100w H38 HX MV ballasts « Reply #11 on: November 08, 2020, 07:54:23 AM » Author: Medved
Generally these ballasts rated for multiple lamps are designed around the lowest current one, so all others are operated underdriven. These ballasts never overdrive the lamps. You may note such ballasts are virtually nonexistennt in Europe (except lamp families explicitely designed to run on a common ballast type). The reason is, EU bans ballasts operating lamps so they do not meet the rated light output without exceeding the rated lamp power input (on dimmable ballasts it must be within the dimming control range, which practically means a full power setting). The lamp families which allow multiple wattages to be run on the same ballast are explicitely designed so their rated current and operating arc voltages pretty exactly follow the ballast load characteristic, so the requirement of the law is met with all of them. You may find some electronic ballasts with rather long list, but these (beside the load characteristic following the specs of varying power lamps) rely on the fact fluorescents suffice with lower power to reach the rated output, so there is about 10% extra current tolerance range to "reach the rated output" while "not exceeding the power input" (exploiting the extra efficacy fluorescents exhibit with HF supply compare to the 50Hz feed the formal rating is made for) in order to still meet the legal requirements.
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	Re: Running European 80w MV lamps on American 100w H38 HX MV ballasts « Reply #12 on: November 08, 2020, 08:22:22 AM » Author: Mandolin Girl
Why are you asking all of these inane questions when you are determined to ignore the advice given.??
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	Re: Running European 80w MV lamps on American 100w H38 HX MV ballasts « Reply #13 on: November 08, 2020, 08:47:00 AM » Author: WorldwideHIDCollectorUSA
I just have the feeling that MV lamps can tolerate some degree of overloading and I think that the lamp being run at 105% power will allow it to have a reasonable lifetime. I am sorry if I irritated anyone.
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Desire to collect various light bulbs (especially HID), control gear, and fixtures from around the world.

DISCLAIMER: THE EXPERIMENTS THAT I CONDUCT INVOLVING UNUSUAL LAMP/BALLAST COMBINATIONS SHOULD NOT BE ATTEMPTED UNLESS YOU HAVE THE PROPER KNOWLEDGE. I AM NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR ANY INJURIES.

	Re: Running European 80w MV lamps on American 100w H38 HX MV ballasts « Reply #14 on: November 08, 2020, 11:13:33 AM » Author: funkybulb
Look  80 and  125 watt lamps are not  common in the USA   80 watt  125 watt mercury lamp been out of production in EU   Since 2015,  I am Asure that  u want your MV lamp last long as  Possabe.   Second set of problems H38 ballast  Have not been in production since 2008,   What will  hapoens   Will affect ballast more than the lamp.   And  this cause balladt current to ride even more due to mismatch lower wattage lamp.   And  that 20 watts of heat has to go some where and it be on the ballast.  I just hate to see you ruin  Good 100  watt H38 ballast.  If your going to play with hid lamps,  it best to invest in proper ballast while u can.  But  Ballast for lamps is going be unobtanable at some point It the future.  Demand for Mercury is dewindling in the US Due ballast fails and LED change over.   I am aready learning  To rewind fluorescent ballast.    Taking bad rapid start ballast  And rewind them for preheat.  I so this going be very Technical  And beyond your scope right now.  You are still fresh and Novice on LG.  Once u start understanding wattage and voltage and current relationship of lamps and understanding how ballast reacts.   That is why some members are getting upset on LG.   Yes it fun trying to find another ballast to run the lamps but do it at your risk and when u do find a replacement  That run lamp propely we be glad to know about it.    In mean time just enjoy collection lamps and ballast. And then enjoy.   The best ballast for 80 watt merc Is a HO F48 fluorescent ballast is one of the Red and blue leads and it will be CWA.
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