Author Topic: Operating/Dimming large halogen lamps on 14VDC  (Read 512 times)
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Operating/Dimming large halogen lamps on 14VDC « on: October 10, 2025, 04:43:02 AM » Author: HomeBrewLamps
I have a few questions and not enough time to research them myself as I have a long weekend ahead... so hopefully you fine lads can help.

Firstly some background. I have a set of 250 watt PAR lamps that i wish to use as auxillary headlamps on my truck. However 250 watt is wayyyy too much. I dont want to melt peoples eyes out peaking hills when I inevitably turn off the lights too slowly.

I would like to dim them down to around 50 percent brightness for "normal high beam use" as this would fall within both reasonable and legal road use guidelines here in my area. When offroad or on extended long flat roads with no hills i could switch them to full power mode.

I am aware that running them in series will dim them roughly by half and would likely require the least amount of components for switching between parallel and series.

But I am also curious about the resistor route. What wattage of resistor would i need to dissipate roughly half of the lamps wattage... 125W? What ohm rating would I need to dim it by half if the lamp is on a 14 volt supply and pulls 250 watts... how much heat would I need to dissipate away from said resistor to prevent failure...


Also would running halogen capsules at half of their rated wattage disrupt the halogen cycle and shorten their life? Or would the filaments still be sufficiently hot to prevent such failure??
« Last Edit: October 10, 2025, 04:45:44 AM by HomeBrewLamps » Logged

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Re: Operating/Dimming large halogen lamps on 14VDC « Reply #1 on: October 10, 2025, 07:54:22 AM » Author: Medved
Half the power means supplying them by about 10V, that is rather impractical (you need either some DCDC or waste a lot of power on a resistor).
Or by a 50% duty ratio PWM.
The later method sounds to me simpler - "just" a power FET controlling each of the lamp, driven alternate manner, so to minimize current ripple into the rest of the electrical system (the current will stay constant, just alternate between left and right lamp).
And because of the large thermal inertia, the switching does not need to be that fast (50..100Hz), so neither the switching edges, so you should get away with rather simple and not that much demanding controller, include the required FET gate driver strength (few mA would be enough, so simple push-pull complementary stage).
The drawback would be both of these lamps will be on a common fuse, so in case of a fault, both will get dark. But because we are talking a bout a supplementary light, which when dies does not pose hazard, so I think it would be acceptable.
And you would need to use a bank of really low RdsON FETS, total in the 1mOhm range. But because of the operating frequencies, it should not be that big problem to drive, even when the gate capacitance would be huge (easily in the 100's nF)...
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Re: Operating/Dimming large halogen lamps on 14VDC « Reply #2 on: October 10, 2025, 10:52:06 AM » Author: Ash
I can help design the circuit Medved suggested and choose the component values if you ask
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Re: Operating/Dimming large halogen lamps on 14VDC « Reply #3 on: October 10, 2025, 04:20:27 PM » Author: RRK
Well, you may try parallel/serial connection essentially for free. Though, running incandescent lamp at 1/2 voltage is not 1/2 brightness, sure.
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Re: Operating/Dimming large halogen lamps on 14VDC « Reply #4 on: October 11, 2025, 01:48:08 AM » Author: Medved
Serial connection reduces the power not to 50%, but to 25% (a bit more in the reality because resistances get lower, but not that much to make for the 25 vs 50 difference). And that would mean barely 5..10% light output. I don't think HomeBrewLamps wanted to go that far...
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Re: Operating/Dimming large halogen lamps on 14VDC « Reply #5 on: October 13, 2025, 03:18:19 AM » Author: HomeBrewLamps
I can help design the circuit Medved suggested and choose the component values if you ask

I would appreciate that... I can design the PCB (Or use prototype board) but I am not entirely certain what component selection I would want. preferably I want it to be tunable with a trim potentiometer so I can fine trim the lamps down to legal limits but if that is not possible without over complicating things then I am fine with a fixed power of roughly half of 250W.

The system would see voltages of between 11V and 15V depending on if the engine is running.
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Re: Operating/Dimming large halogen lamps on 14VDC « Reply #6 on: October 13, 2025, 04:32:52 AM » Author: Medved
Quote
I want it to be tunable with a trim potentiometer

Making it any other than permanent ON (100%) and alternate 50% would make it quite problematic: It would mean the input current pulsing and that can upset the car electrical system if not handled properly. And handling it properly needs extra power capacitors and filters, then you need to treat inrush currents and so on.
The beauty of 50% duty ratio is, you effectively just redirect the current between the first and second lamp, so the input current into the system remains rather constant and smooth, so you can getaway without that complicated filtering.
So 3 levels are possible with such smooth input current:
25% as both lamps in series (even though this would make the circuit somewhat more complicated)
50% as full voltage alternating between both lamps
100% as both lamps at constant full power.

If you suffice with just the "50%" and "100%" (and OFF, of course) the circuit could be quite simple, common "+" connection to the lamps directly from the main power relay, with the regulation switching performed on the GND side. You can then even get away without reverse polarity protection in the power path (required for any electronics in the car), as there will always be the bulb in series (with the reverse polarity the bulb will just light up, so no problem).
Or using high side switches (using high side smart FETs) it can use direct schassis ground connection for the lamps (some grounding screw nearby). But that would create a bit more electromagnetic mess by the ground current distribution.
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Re: Operating/Dimming large halogen lamps on 14VDC « Reply #7 on: October 13, 2025, 07:10:23 PM » Author: Ash
Here is a circuit implementing Medved's proposed design

I have added some controls and protections which i think are advisable to have here. It is however possible to build a working circuit with less than 1/2 of what i put in

Most component values are chosen based on a quick approximate evaluation. They might be somewhat off and require tweaking. I tried to get at least the most critical ones right

Most components are not exact value critical. I chose them to be same values as the critical ones to reduce the number of different component types

The few components that are critical are :
 - R1 and C1 - determine the switching frequency
 - Resistive dividers in the protection circuits - determine protection thresholds
 - Fuse F2 - there is not much design headroom here. It must be small enough to reliably blow in case of a short, while R26 limits the current, and slow enough (time delay type) to not blow from charging of capacitors at startup

When connecting the MOSFETs, connect with 4mm2 wire right on the MOSFET leads. Use short flexible wires and terminate them in a terminal block secured to the same heatsink as the MOSFETs, to prevent mechanical stress on the MOSFET leads from flexing or vibration

When connecting the grounds, connect all grounds of the signal circuit to a single point, and then connect it to the main (high current circuit) ground in a single point together with the MOSFETs. Do not connect grounds of individual components of the signal circuit to the high current circuit directly, as this may cause malfunction due to voltage drop

All components used are Through Hole

All components are available from Digikey



@Medved
I would like some input about the circuit too, especially about the following :
 - Transient voltage protection - Is there better way to do it ?
 - Filtering of small ripple signals (due to switching deadtime, lamps not exactly the same, etc) - Is it critical at this level ?

« Last Edit: October 13, 2025, 07:19:36 PM by Ash » Logged
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Re: Operating/Dimming large halogen lamps on 14VDC « Reply #8 on: October 13, 2025, 07:41:50 PM » Author: RRK
Love how this thing is overcomplicated ;)

BTW, your Schmidt trigger U4A is configured improperly, it is not a good idea to add an integrating capacitor to the positive feedback network, and so, the circuit output will still flip-flop when input crosses the threshold. You better add a capacitor to an input, and keep positive feedback fast. Also, if you use some normal opamps as comparators here, not open-collector style LM393, you sure can save a lot of components.

Out of multitude of modern integrated circuits, there are for example MAX809 chips (and a million its $0.2 clones) which do power monitoring in a single SOT23-3 also with an useful time-out...

TL431s can also be tricked to be power monitor comparators when used open-loop.



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Re: Operating/Dimming large halogen lamps on 14VDC « Reply #9 on: October 14, 2025, 02:34:14 AM » Author: Medved
I also think this is overcomplicated.
- The gate drive will suffice with barely a mA, the frequency I would not do any faster than about 100Hz. So driving it from a simple two transistor driver should be enough.
- The switching even should not be that fast, with so fast edges, it would create way too high spikes on the wiring inductance. AEC specifies equivalent wiring inductances to anticipate up to 5uH, we are switching 20A in them so if we tolerate about 20..30V overshoots, it means about 2..5us current slopes. With the Gm of about 210S and Cgs of about 24nF it means about 0.6mA gate discharge current. So the 3..5mA should be more than enough. It is asking for a kind of adaptive gate drive: You discharge the gate quickly by up to 20mA via a stronger transistor and diode into the drain and then slowly via the gate series resistor by the 0.6..1mA, so the bulk of the gate charge gets away quickly so won't cause that much delay and once the transistor starts to switch off, the gate current gets reduced so won't create any huge overshoot.

Transients to expect are described in ISO 7637-2.
The really high voltage ones are of an inductive kick origins, so have higher impedance and short time, a series input diode and a good quality electrolytic on the battery input, a pairs of series 100nF ceramics (you need to use two in series on anything without current limitation such as the battery line, as these tend to fail short circuit, which could lead to fire; there are "flex" rated capacitors which you can use just one, but those could be hard to get for "normal civilian"), one pair in front and one behind the diode is usually enough.
Then there is the "load dump" (simulates disconnection of a loaded and fully biased alternator, mainly happening when battery is failing by first shorting a cell, overcharging the rest and then internal connection breaking due to severe overcharge), which means the thing should tolerate 40V (the alternator is expected to clamp the voltage between 28..40V under this condition) on the battery input for at least a second (the time it may take for the field excitation to dissipate).
And then of course the voltage excursions like starting undervoltage (may lead to transistor damage because of insufficient gate drive voltage under load) down to 3.5V, "jump start" overvoltages up to 28V for a minute or so, plus the "slow battery charge/discharge" (voltage ramp down/up 12V to 0 and back over a few hours), these are asking for over and undervoltage shut downs (the overvoltage won't be threatening the electronics that much, as it will the lamps). Normal range is normally specified as 8..16V, where it is supposed to work normally. So I would put the undervoltage to about 7.5V and overvoltage to 18V.
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Re: Operating/Dimming large halogen lamps on 14VDC « Reply #10 on: October 14, 2025, 03:08:54 AM » Author: RRK
In fact we are talking about chopping may be 20-30% from lamp's power, for 500W load that means just a couple of 0.2 Ohms 100W power resistors in parallel, placed in some well-ventilated area, no big deal... And no messing with any electronics...



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Re: Operating/Dimming large halogen lamps on 14VDC « Reply #11 on: October 14, 2025, 04:14:09 AM » Author: HomeBrewLamps
I do quite like the conversation that this has sparked up... the circuit Ash has drawn up is quite interesting. it seems to be quite thought out. components are cheap though so I don't mind building that if the circuit is functional. it seems Medved has critiques however so I shall stay tuned.

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Re: Operating/Dimming large halogen lamps on 14VDC « Reply #12 on: October 14, 2025, 06:54:27 AM » Author: Ash
Love how this thing is overcomplicated ;)
A barebones version would be just the SG3524 and 2 power MOSFETs (driven directly by the 3524), and powered directly from 12V (so dont need the voltage regulator either). The rest implement the protections

As Medved pointed out the 3524 too can too be eliminated and replaced with just 2 transistors, though i consider the proper PWM ICs (even though this circuit does not actually use PWM, the IC is pinned to work at max duty cycle) as a better controlled option. In particular, because it uses a single timing R and C, it is not sensitive to the exact component values to keep exactly symmetrical output duty cycle



BTW, your Schmidt trigger U4A is configured improperly, it is not a good idea to add an integrating capacitor to the positive feedback network, and so, the circuit output will still flip-flop when input crosses the threshold. You better add a capacitor to an input, and keep positive feedback fast. Also, if you use some normal opamps as comparators here, not open-collector style LM393, you sure can save a lot of components.
Can you explain more whats the issue with the ST ?

The output of each comparator drives few things : One or two outputs to control the primary circuit, and the hysteresis loop. To keep them separated from each other i would need some active components anyhow (be it transistors or diodes), so it would allow eliminating the pull up or maybe an inverting transistor, but it would not allow connecting everything together to the comparator output



Out of multitude of modern integrated circuits, there are for example MAX809 chips (and a million its $0.2 clones) which do power monitoring in a single SOT23-3 also with an useful time-out...
One of the design requirements i considered is using exclusively through hole components, to make it straightforward to assemble by hand on a prototype board

I have another circuit in design here (for a project for local customer) where i use a SOT23-5 MIC2774



TL431s can also be tricked to be power monitor comparators when used open-loop.
Yes, but here is something i found out : They are sensitive to dv/dt across K-A terminals. So for example, if you use it as a comparator to turn on an optoisolator in OVP protection, it might blink the optoisolator for a quick blink just the moment when the voltage is applied, even if there was no overshoot

Not a problem if the condition the TL431 tests is normal during the starting of a power supply (such as undervoltage), then it will at most just delay the reported signal by some usec



I also think this is overcomplicated.
- The gate drive will suffice with barely a mA, the frequency I would not do any faster than about 100Hz. So driving it from a simple two transistor driver should be enough.
- The switching even should not be that fast, with so fast edges, it would create way too high spikes on the wiring inductance
I have not checked the power dissipation the MOSFETs would have if the transition time is intentionally extended. With the current fast acting implementation, I just assume that the transition is short enough to not have any significant effect, so only I2R matters

If so, it is possible to eliminate the gate driver and connect the same lines directly to the 2 MOSFETs (with appropriate resistor values)

And in any case, flyback diode (near the mosfet) and twisted pair wiring on the way to the lamps will reduce the transient and the emissions



Transients to expect are described in ISO 7637-2.
The really high voltage ones are of an inductive kick origins, so have higher impedance and short time, a series input diode and a good quality electrolytic on the battery input, a pairs of series 100nF ceramics (you need to use two in series on anything without current limitation such as the battery line, as these tend to fail short circuit, which could lead to fire; there are "flex" rated capacitors which you can use just one, but those could be hard to get for "normal civilian"), one pair in front and one behind the diode is usually enough.
I have referred to this : https://www.ti.com/lit/ml/slyb232/slyb232.pdf

Specifically i designed to address the load dump condition. There are 2 variants shown there, one with and one without clamping. I don't know the conditions in the target car this is meant to be installed in, so assumed a transient to 100V

What is the input series diode required for ? To prevent pulling reverse current through the linear regulator ?

If the circit is under low load, won't the diode just cause the capacitors after it to charge to the peak value of the transient and remain there for longer time (few sec or more), potentially causing damage to components which are only rated for 400ms transient ?

The "flex" SMD capacitors are readily available from Digikey, and in this circuit it is a moot point anyway because all the capacitors used are Through Hole

Also, would the power MOSFETs (that stand in the high current, unprotected part of the circuit) need protection from transients over 100V ?



Then there is the "load dump"
The MIC2940A is already rated to 60V transient at its input (and at the same time has fairly low dropout voltage for such high input voltage rating - about 0.75V at full load, so probably on the order of 0.5V for small loads). So i added a resistor and TVS to clamp its input voltage to <60V, and all the rest of the circuit which gets raw battery voltage is designed to 100V. (The 3.3K resistors in the EOL detection circuit are 0.5W, they could survive 100V for a second or so, which already exceeds the standard requirements)

My biggest question here is with the 2R resistor at the input of the linear regulator :

I think a resistor is essential :
 - To limit the ripple current from the lamp circuit from going to the capacitors here and overloading them
 - To limit the peak current in case of a low impedance voltage transient, so the TVS does not try to protect the entire car

However, this resistor would limit also a short circuit current in case someting goes wrong in the signal circuit. So the fuse F2 cannot be too high value. And it cannot be too low value or too fast, or it will blow from charging of the capacitor at power on. I figured T0.25A is acceptable from both requirements, but the margins are not huge

The circuit here is protected from undervoltage in the signal circuit. The UV thresholds with the resistors i put there are 9V for start and 8V for shutdown. With the linear regulator drop, this would mean something like 9.5V downto 8.5V on the 12V input. The power MOSFETs have >500W rating (Tc 25C), so the reaction speed of the UV protection would be adequate as long as they have some thermal mass of heatsink attached and didnt have the time to heat it up significantly

There is no OVP. It can be added with a single TL431 and couple resistors. (The protection is not latching, so it won't get stuck in OFF like in the case above)



In fact we are talking about chopping may be 20-30% from lamp's power, for 500W load that means just a couple of 0.2 Ohms 100W power resistors in parallel, placed in some well-ventilated area, no big deal... And no messing with any electronics...
Try the steel strips in which building bricks are packed on pallets. 3 meters of such strip in free air (installed on insulators for busbars for electrical board construction etc) is easily a high power, low value resistor. But if exposed to moisture they may corrode, as they are not made of any high quality steel



I do quite like the conversation that this has sparked up... the circuit Ash has drawn up is quite interesting. it seems to be quite thought out. components are cheap though so I don't mind building that if the circuit is functional. it seems Medved has critiques however so I shall stay tuned.
This circuit includes some elements i have used in other designs of mine. But there are things which i am still actively researching like how to build transient voltage protections, and what other conditions to address. Using this opportunity to learn from Medved and RRK
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Re: Operating/Dimming large halogen lamps on 14VDC « Reply #13 on: October 14, 2025, 09:30:30 AM » Author: Medved
Any modern car is designed with load dump clamping (within the alternator), so 40 or 45V rating is OK. For the last 20 years I work in this field I haven't seen any automotive customer asking for anything more for the 14V power system.
So most of the common power management chips are indeed OK (in fact that is why the 40V rating is so common). So a 60V device is more than enough.

Normally the one second requirement is practically a DC requirement for electrical rating (no excessive current appearing like breakdowns,...). It just mean the thing does not need to be able to handle the load dump from the power dissipation perspective (e.g. a 5V regulator loaded by 100mA needs to be designed for 1.3DC, 2.8W for one minute and 3.5W just for that one second, but electrically it needs to be rated for the 40V on its input).
So a capacitor charged to 40V only adds extra thermal energy, for a 220uF (which should be way sufficient here) it will be about 0.176J, so a 300mW rated component will discharge it within half a second when the power dissipation is within its rating. So unless you plan to use 10's of mF, I do not see problem there...


The hysteresis feedbacks are indeed wrong there.
With hysteresis, the feedback loop forming it (so from the output back to the input) needs to be fast, without any low pass filter in it. Otherwise the inputs may be lingering for way too long time close to each other, so even a bit of wrong feedback or some noise and you have the output toggling erratically - exactly the behavior the hysteresis is supposed to prevent in the first place.
And for the same reason it needs to be as short as possible, so over as few stages as possible (you should not forget the comparator alone has at least 3..4 gain stages inside, normally when reviewing a circuit which is supposed to becoming part of an integrated circuit, I consider that as way too much and question such designs whether it is really necessary). Here you have no other option than go over the whole comparator, but the extra transistor inverter could be avoided.
So separate the filter capacitor by some extra resistor from the comparator input.
or (the better way, as it avoids the hysteresis loop to go via the extra transistor inverter) implement the hysteresis loop around the noninverting input on the reference.

For the "proper PWM":
The SG3525 would make sense, but it has somewhat restricted logic if you want to implement all 3 modes (100%, 50% and 0% when faults are detected), that logic needs to be glued on externally, so the simplicity goes away.
The symmetry with the frequency divider is indeed precise, but according to me not really needed for the task.
I would use very simple astable multivibrator (along the first picture) using two gates from CD4001, while the second inputs are connected together to the "100%/50%" switchover signal (High means the multivibrator will be stopped, outputs permanently low, so the next stage will invert it to both transistors permanently ON), with the other two gates used to switch the output OFF when a fault is detected (over/under voltage, over temperature,...). The second pair of the gates then can practically directly drive the MOSFET gates via some NPN/PNP push-pull follower and few resistors to control the gate currents.
When the resistor feedback is not coming from the NOR gates output but from the drains of the output FETs (normally the supply voltage for the CD4001 and the lamps will be nearly identical, so the levels will be correct) and add some bleeder (e.g. 10kOhm) resistors parallel to the FETs, the circuit will stop oscillating once one of the lamps burns out, so prevent the circuit from kicking into the car supply system when one of the loads disappear, it will then leave the second lamp at full brightness.
Then a quad comparator IC will be used to observe the supply and do the UV/OV and the transistor temperature and destaturation monitoring and generate the High for the second pair of the NORs in order to shut the output down.

The CD4001 supply can be then done by just a series resistor of about 1kOhm and a 15V Zener diode, which will protect both the CD4001, as well as the MOSFET gates against overvoltage events (load dumps,...). Similar series 1kOhm could be used to supply the quad comparator. Then you need no voltage regulator and you push all the overvoltage events onto the resistors. To withstand the 40V load dump, the 1kOhm resistors will need to be about 0.5W rated and still have margin for the 1s load dump time.

Yes, the astable multivibrator won't be that precise, but if you make sure you connect the circuit in a symmetrical way (if one side the "A" input goes to the timing RC, on the other side it needs to be the "A" as well, the inputs are not equal) and use the same type of components, the timing may vary a lot, but both sides will vary the same way, wheather it is because of temperature drift, voltage dependence, the CD4001 process variation or aging, so the duty will stay close enough to the required 50% for this application.


Later on today I will try to draw what I mean...
Update:
This is the core of what I mean.

But generally this application, even such simple, is really asking for a small microcontroller: An ATtiny13V with two pairs of gate driver transistors (to translate the outputs to 12V levels for the gates) would make the circuit way simpler, yet allow way more refined operation and mainly protection logic (e.g. ON state voltage drop monitoring, with decent debouncers and retry logic in order to allow protection against short to VBAT, yet to not shut down on any disturbance spike,...).



And by the way the "simple series resistor" would be way greater nightmare to design, even ignoring the corrosion problems.
\First 2x 100W dissipation is ridiculous power to handle in the crammed car environment without forced cooling. Then deal with the failure of such cooling.
Unlike 1mOhm MOSFETS, a lamp short circuit won't just blow the upstream fuse, because the resitors would limit the current (to about 45A, so not that much above the 20A normal working current of each lamp). But it would cause them to generate about 10x as much heat than in normal operation, so a short circuit would be an event really asking for severe car fire.
So no, something that may seem simple can really very quickly become unsolvable nightmare.
« Last Edit: October 14, 2025, 03:38:17 PM by Medved » Logged

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Re: Operating/Dimming large halogen lamps on 14VDC « Reply #14 on: October 14, 2025, 05:03:57 PM » Author: RRK
I would take a good old IR2153 to do this kind of project. Heck, even Helvar used these in their dimming fluorescent ballasts)

IR2153 is typically meant for high voltage half bridges, but bootstrap can be omitted and this circuit will become a very easy 50% push-pull driver, that   exactly what is needed! Even UVLO is already included. And the circuit may be stopped just by shorting the timing capacitor, if required. So you can implement EOL circuit easily too, if you are paranoid about this) I am skeptical if this is ever needed...

One thing to consider is how to make 100% mode. One particularly dirty hack that came to my mind on the walk from work to home is just to break the ground connection of IR2153. That way, both outputs will be pulled to +12V bus and both MOSFETs will turn on. If you consider this too dirty, opening voltages could be mixed to gate signals through a couple of diodes, like in original schematics.

A as the power consumption of IR2153 is pretty low, especially at such low commutating frequency, a very simple power supply may suffice. A 1W 12V zener, a suitable ballast resistor with a Shottky diode to battery (+) and a couple of bypassing capacitors of 0.1 and 100uF. Simple, but indestructible!


Something like this https://danyk.cz/igbt5_en.html
You see IR2153 schematics is uber simple, but does the work well.
Love this person's soldering style haha.

Sure we don't need such amount of snubber garlands for our application.
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