Let's say you want to build a MV fixture.
You can get the lamps and fixture enclosure, But not the ballast. (Currently)
But fluorescent ballasts are legal.
What if you had a ballast/driver that can switch between them?
What are the legal penalties for making a ballast?
What about a magnetic style electronic ballast?
What about importing ballasts? Would they stop you at Customs?

Let's say you want to build a MV fixture.
You can get the lamps and fixture enclosure, But not the ballast. (Currently)
But fluorescent ballasts are legal.
What if you had a ballast/driver that can switch between them?
What are the legal penalties for making a ballast?

It is illegal to manyfacture and/or import MV ballasts in the US. Connecting fluorescent ballasts together to run an MV lamp IS "manufacturing" an MV ballast, so it is illegal.

What about a magnetic style electronic ballast?

The Act does not distinguish, so if it is supposed to run an MV, it is illegal as well.
By the way what do you mean by "magnetic style electronic ballast"? There is no ballast design, except just a series capacitor (lamp killer) and/or resistor (wasting power), that would not rely to some magnetic component for the main functionality.

What about importing ballasts? Would they stop you at Customs?

If they were really rigorous, yes. But I doubt they would ever do so, unless someone explicitly tell them...
But definitely a heavy item in a luggage when returning from a holiday will rise some suspicion, but more a security related, than really energy related or so.

What I mean about "Magnetic Style Electronic" is essentially a Programmed Start (Electronic Preheating) without the HF driving.

What about a LED driver that "accidentally" has a capability to run MV.
Or if it is not advertised? (Doesn't tell you that it can)

I'm not talking about bringing ballasts in luggage, But what if someone had a cargo ship full of heavy items, And this was one of them?

You can buy an Arlen Pulsestarter or similar electronic starter, to make your magnetic preheat fluorescent fixture, start like a programmed start electronic ballast.

What I mean about "Magnetic Style Electronic" is essentially a Programmed Start (Electronic Preheating) without the HF driving.

What about a LED driver that "accidentally" has a capability to run MV.
Or if it is not advertised? (Doesn't tell you that it can)

Well, that would really need quite freaky "accident": LED's need DC feed, MV's AC. MV's exhibit negative resistance sections in their VA curves, so do not allow any significant parallel capacitor. LED's are nice, smooth monotonic (even when steep), so even  a larger capacitor on the output is not big problem (assume the connection between the ballast and lamp is permanent, no switching when the thing is powered).
So it would be really strange LED ballast, if it "happens" to be compatible with MV's, I doubt you will get any conformance certificate for such thing...

I'm not talking about bringing ballasts in luggage, But what if someone had a cargo ship full of heavy items, And this was one of them?

Well, it is smuggling like any other. If it is illegal, well definitely it is. If you get caught or if the customs would really care, that is not 100% sure.

Quote from: wattMaster on May 23, 2016, 06:05:25 PM

What I mean about "Magnetic Style Electronic" is essentially a Programmed Start (Electronic Preheating) without the HF driving.

What about a LED driver that "accidentally" has a capability to run MV.
Or if it is not advertised? (Doesn't tell you that it can)

Well, that would really need quite freaky "accident": LED's need DC feed, MV's AC. MV's exhibit negative resistance sections in their VA curves, so do not allow any significant parallel capacitor. LED's are nice, smooth monotonic (even when steep), so even  a larger capacitor on the output is not big problem (assume the connection between the ballast and lamp is permanent, no switching when the thing is powered).
So it would be really strange LED ballast, if it "happens" to be compatible with MV's, I doubt you will get any conformance certificate for such thing...

Quote from: wattMaster on May 23, 2016, 06:05:25 PM

I'm not talking about bringing ballasts in luggage, But what if someone had a cargo ship full of heavy items, And this was one of them?

Well, it is smuggling like any other. If it is illegal, well definitely it is. If you get caught or if the customs would really care, that is not 100% sure.

I'm not planning to do any of this, But it's confusing.
It's like: "Don't make MV ballasts or else..." And they don't tell you what will happen.

You can buy an Arlen Pulsestarter or similar electronic starter, to make your magnetic preheat fluorescent fixture, start like a programmed start electronic ballast.

Problem is, Magnetic ballasts are almost extinct.

It's like: "Don't make MV ballasts or else..." And they don't tell you what will happen.

The building/fire codes generally require to use only certified components. That means the certification must be valid and cover the way how it is used. So that means the fluorescent ballast certification covers only the use for ballasting the designed fluorescent lamp, for anything else it becomes not certified part (so as it would not had any UL or similar certificate).
And what are the consequences of manufacturing that ballast? You would have to ask some lawyer...

Quote from: wattMaster on May 24, 2016, 11:32:44 AM

It's like: "Don't make MV ballasts or else..." And they don't tell you what will happen.

The building/fire codes generally require to use only certified components. That means the certification must be valid and cover the way how it is used. So that means the fluorescent ballast certification covers only the use for ballasting the designed fluorescent lamp, for anything else it becomes not certified part (so as it would not had any UL or similar certificate).
And what are the consequences of manufacturing that ballast? You would have to ask some lawyer...

...And realize you just spent enough money to buy a NOS MV ballast.

...And realize you just spent enough money to buy a NOS MV ballast.

Well, that is the best you may do, if you find some. It is present in the US for long time, it is certified to operate an MV, so perfectly legal and acceptable.

Glad a nearby church/art club (I still don't know. The art club has an event called Favo, Try looking it up) has several almost-pure-green MV lamps.

Think something like this :

 - Pulse MH or (for 250W+) HPS ballast with ignitor

 - Failed ignitor, making it not work, but still let the ballast supply current to the socket. (The failure is intentional, but nobody should know about that...)

 - MV lamp in the socket

This way, the only actual sins are bad QA on the manufacturer's part (for letting the lantern with bad ignitor go through undetected, but it is not forbidden to make crap quality products....), and screwing the wrong lamp into the socket on the user's part, which is not the manufacturer's fault

Think something like this :

 - Pulse MH or (for 250W+) HPS ballast with ignitor

 - Failed ignitor, making it not work, but still let the ballast supply current to the socket. (The failure is intentional, but nobody should know about that...)

 - MV lamp in the socket

This way, the only actual sins are bad QA on the manufacturer's part (for letting the lantern with bad ignitor go through undetected, but it is not forbidden to make crap quality products....), and screwing the wrong lamp into the socket on the user's part, which is not the manufacturer's fault

Nice solution. I'm still trying to figure out why they banned ballasts, But not bulbs.

You are the government and you want to get rid of Mercury lighting (including mostly Mercury lighting you dont own)

If you ban everything at once, peeps will rise up big backlash, as they only recently bought new (Mercury) lanterns and spent quite a lot of money on them, and suddenly the lamps are banned

So you do it in steps :

1. Ban the lanterns (or ballasts)

2. Wait untill the existing lanterns in use become "old" and "worthless"

3. Ban the lamps and peeps won't complain as much cause they will accept that "it is time for a new lantern anyway"

The lamp ban was planned for the beginning of this year, but eventually they figured out that the environmental impact from Mercury lighting is less than the impact from cutting down the trees to make the paper on which they sign the ban...

You are the government and you want to get rid of Mercury lighting (including mostly Mercury lighting you dont own)

If you ban everything at once, peeps will rise up big backlash, as they only recently bought new (Mercury) lanterns and spent quite a lot of money on them, and suddenly the lamps are banned

So you do it in steps :

1. Ban the lanterns (or ballasts)

2. Wait untill the existing lanterns in use become "old" and "worthless"

3. Ban the lamps and peeps won't complain as much cause they will accept that "it is time for a new lantern anyway"

The lamp ban was planned for the beginning of this year, but eventually they figured out that the environmental impact from Mercury lighting is less than the impact from cutting down the trees to make the paper on which they sign the ban...

Problem is, the lighting collectors (us) don't think it is ready for "better" fixtures.